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Double standards in how we cover Saudi Arabian and Iranian behavior and statements

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  • pamak
    replied
    Originally posted by 101combatvet View Post

    Really? Gee, I've even met some.
    This is a comment which does not explain why you believe that Iranians might even support unofficially an independent Kurdistan when Iran has a Kurdish population near its borders with Iraq.

    Leave a comment:


  • 101combatvet
    replied
    Originally posted by pamak View Post

    Is this from your sources?
    Did you see the map with the kurdish population in Iran?

    Here it is...

    Iranian-ethno-languages-map.png



    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iranian_Kurdistan

    Iranian Kurdistan, or Eastern Kurdistan (Kurdish: RojhilatÍ KurdistanÍ, ڕۆژھەڵاتی کوردستان‎), is an unofficial name for the parts of northwestern Iran inhabited by Kurds which borders Iraq and Turkey. It includes the West Azerbaijan Province,[note 1]Kurdistan Province, Kermanshah Province, Ilam Province[2][3][4] and Hamadan Province.[5] There is also a significant Kurdish population in the North Khorasan Province.[6][7]

    Kurds generally consider Iranian Kurdistan (Eastern Kurdistan) to be one of the four parts of a proposed Kurdistan state, which also includes parts of southeastern Turkey (Northern Kurdistan), northern Syria (Western Kurdistan) and northern Iraq (Southern Kurdistan).[8]
    Really? Gee, I've even met some.

    Leave a comment:


  • pamak
    replied
    Originally posted by 101combatvet View Post

    Iran probably isn't concerned with a Kurdish independent state. Actually, they might unofficially support it.
    Is this from your "sources"?
    Did you see the map with the kurdish population in Iran?

    Here it is...

    Iranian-ethno-languages-map.png



    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iranian_Kurdistan

    Iranian Kurdistan, or Eastern Kurdistan (Kurdish: RojhilatÍ KurdistanÍ, ڕۆژھەڵاتی کوردستان‎), is an unofficial name for the parts of northwestern Iran inhabited by Kurds which borders Iraq and Turkey. It includes the West Azerbaijan Province,[note 1]Kurdistan Province, Kermanshah Province, Ilam Province[2][3][4] and Hamadan Province.[5] There is also a significant Kurdish population in the North Khorasan Province.[6][7]

    Kurds generally consider Iranian Kurdistan (Eastern Kurdistan) to be one of the four parts of a proposed Kurdistan state, which also includes parts of southeastern Turkey (Northern Kurdistan), northern Syria (Western Kurdistan) and northern Iraq (Southern Kurdistan).[8]

    Leave a comment:


  • 101combatvet
    replied
    Originally posted by pamak View Post

    Because all these countries have a common interest in prohibiting the emergence of an independent Kurdish state, and Iraq welcomes any help that serves its interests. The second sentence is just a claim without evidence to support it. As long as the US is Iraq's ally and Iran's adversary, Iran cannot just exert control in Kurdistan inside Iraq.
    Iran probably isn't concerned with a Kurdish independent state. Actually, they might unofficially support it.

    Leave a comment:


  • pamak
    replied
    Originally posted by ljadw View Post

    US has also forces in Syria ,thus ....

    And Iran invaded Iraq when US (= BHO ) had mainly left Iraq and, as far as I know, US forces did not occupy Kurdistan after the fall of Saddam.
    US has not the power to expel Iran from Kurdistan (there are only a few thousand of US military in Iraq with as task the training of the Iraqi army ) , and, why should it do it ? While the US are fighting against Iran in Syria, there is for the monent no fighting between US and Iran in Iraq.

    Turkey,OTOH, a staunch henchman of Iran, occupies 20 villages in Amedi and 8 in Soran .
    If the Iranians are in Kurdistan without the consent of Iraq, it is an invasion .
    If they are in Kurdistan with the consent of Iraq, this means that without their presence, Kurdistan would become independent and that Bagdad is unable to control Kurdistan
    Iran did not invade Kurdistan. It actually helped the Iraqis fight successfully ISIS which is the reason why it gained influence and respect in the region.

    Also, you speculate and while you tell me to prove my points, you refuse to prove yours. If Turkey was not in Kurdistan, Iraq could still have control of Kurdistan. We do not know how things could have changed. In addition, even though the US does not have the power to expel Iran from Kurdistan ((or more accurately diminish its influence), since the decision rests with Iraqis, the US STILL has the power to expose Iran's actions. As we can see Trump is quite hostile to Iran. Therefore, the idea that Iran has managed to dominate in Kurdistan while the US has basically remained silent UNDER TRUMP, is absurd!,All we can see is that Iran has gained influence in Kurdistan (with the consent of the Iraqi governnent). Also, the fact that the Kurdish press (as I showed) criticizes Iraq and its effort to relocate Arabs (and not Persians) in the region shows that the Kurdish perceive that Iraq is their main problem. Even if you do not believe in the accuracy of the Kurdish Press, the simple fact of choosing Iraq as their target shows their perspective.
    Last edited by pamak; 18 Aug 18, 16:09.

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  • ljadw
    replied
    Originally posted by pamak View Post


    We still have troops there, and I do not think that we launched a second invasion there, right?

    But more
    importantly, the US is CLEARLY Iran's adversary , and THIS is an additional reason to refute your claim that Iran has established control in Kurdistan. Ironically, it seems you try to argue that Trump has suffered a defeat in the region, and we are not aware of it....
    US has also forces in Syria ,thus ....

    And Iran invaded Iraq when US (= BHO ) had mainly left Iraq and, as far as I know, US forces did not occupy Kurdistan after the fall of Saddam.
    US has not the power to expel Iran from Kurdistan (there are only a few thousand of US military in Iraq with as task the training of the Iraqi army ) , and, why should it do it ? While the US are fighting against Iran in Syria, there is for the monent no fighting between US and Iran in Iraq.

    Turkey,OTOH, a staunch henchman of Iran, occupies 20 villages in Amedi and 8 in Soran .
    If the Iranians are in Kurdistan without the consent of Iraq, it is an invasion .
    If they are in Kurdistan with the consent of Iraq, this means that without their presence, Kurdistan would become independent and that Bagdad is unable to control Kurdistan

    Leave a comment:


  • pamak
    replied
    Originally posted by ljadw View Post

    Prove that US is still the ally of Iraq ?

    We still have troops there, and I do not think that we launched a second invasion there, right?

    But more
    importantly, the US is CLEARLY Iran's adversary , and THIS is an additional reason to refute your claim that Iran has established control in Kurdistan. Ironically, it seems you try to argue that Trump has suffered a defeat in the region, and we are not aware of it....

    Leave a comment:


  • pamak
    replied
    Originally posted by ljadw View Post

    You should candidate for Congress ,the swamp likes people who dodge questions .
    Last year, the Independent said that Iran was taking over Iraq . Potential outcomes ,it is reality , not a potential outcome .
    Nope! YOU TRIED to pass it as "reality." The article did not present it as such! I assume this is why you did to want to post the link here...

    Leave a comment:


  • ljadw
    replied
    Originally posted by pamak View Post

    Because all these countries have a common interest in prohibiting the emergence of an independent Kurdish state, and Iraq welcomes any help that serves its interests. The second sentence is just a claim without evidence to support it. As long as the US is Iraq's ally and Iran's adversary, Iran cannot just exert control in Kurdistan inside Iraq.
    Prove that US is still the ally of Iraq ?

    Leave a comment:


  • ljadw
    replied
    Originally posted by pamak View Post

    The first reference is way way older than the events we are talking about. The same is true with the second reference. In addition, the second link talks about potential outcomes and not actual results. Finally, the last reference is current, and of course, it does not mention anything about Iran controlling Kurdistan.
    You should candidate for Congress ,the swamp likes people who dodge questions .
    Last year, the Independent said that Iran was taking over Iraq . Potential outcomes ,it is reality , not a potential outcome .

    Leave a comment:


  • pamak
    replied
    Originally posted by ljadw View Post
    From the number 2 and 3 of Pamak's favourites (the number 1,the Pravda, no longer exists )

    July 2015 : NYT : Iran dominates in Iraq,after US handed over the country .

    August 17 2017 : The Independent : Can anyone stop Iran from taking over Iraq ?

    And,from the ISIS Middle East Monitor March 7 2018 :Tehran says the nature of the presence of its forces (in Syria and Iraq ) is '' advisory '' .
    The first reference is way way older than the events we are talking about. The same is true with the second reference. In addition, the second link talks about potential outcomes and not actual results. Finally, the last reference is current, and of course, it does not mention anything about Iran controlling Kurdistan.

    Leave a comment:


  • pamak
    replied
    Originally posted by ljadw View Post

    If Iraq is still controlling Kurdistan, why are the Iranians and the Turks still there ?
    If you need foreign armies to control a part of your country,these foreign armies are in control,not you .
    Because all these countries have a common interest in prohibiting the emergence of an independent Kurdish state, and Iraq welcomes any help that serves its interests. The second sentence is just a claim without evidence to support it. As long as the US is Iraq's ally and Iran's adversary, Iran cannot just exert control in Kurdistan inside Iraq.

    Leave a comment:


  • ljadw
    replied
    From the number 2 and 3 of Pamak's favourites (the number 1,the Pravda, no longer exists )

    July 2015 : NYT : Iran dominates in Iraq,after US handed over the country .

    August 17 2017 : The Independent : Can anyone stop Iran from taking over Iraq ?

    And,from the ISIS Middle East Monitor March 7 2018 :Tehran says the nature of the presence of its forces (in Syria and Iraq ) is '' advisory '' .

    Leave a comment:


  • ljadw
    replied
    Originally posted by pamak View Post

    The reports that Kurdistan is not independent despite the referendum should be enough to prove my point that Iraq is still in control. Also, with respect to exaggerations and inaccurate reports about the situation in Iraq, the US military has its fair share of blame. So, unless you show details, you are just gasping at straws to prove your point. I used multiple sources from different sources including humanitarian organizations and Kurdish sources and all post to the same conclusion. You are clueless....
    If Iraq is still controlling Kurdistan, why are the Iranians and the Turks still there ?
    If you need foreign armies to control a part of your country,these foreign armies are in control,not you .

    Leave a comment:


  • 101combatvet
    replied
    Originally posted by pamak View Post

    If Kurdistan is not under an effective Iraqi control (as you clearly implied)
    https://forums.armchairgeneral.com/f...22#post5055922
    then there is no reason not to have Kurdistan being independent. There is a reason why the Kurds could not enforce the result of the referendum.
    It's not even worth explaining anything to you. Have a nice night.

    Leave a comment:

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