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Did the Anti ICE group seriously consider the consequences of their demands?

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  • #31
    Originally posted by Gixxer86g View Post

    Huh? Answer the question.

    You're special, aren't you? In the short yellow bus kind of way.
    What special?

    Your question is a typical irrational excuse which people like you use when they want to justify why they need an echo-chamber. Did you ask conservative posters if they post here because they want other people to notice them because they are "special"? No!

    Why exactly do we participate in political forums? I think the obvious answer is because we want others to hear our thoughts! If it was not that, then we could as well start talking to a wall! It is not that it bother me when somebody ignore me. It bothers me when somebody lives in that echo-chamber. It bothers me when somebody pretends that it is only the mainstream media of the adversary which propagate "fake news" and uses this BS excuse to justify his choice to only read media which propagate his political beliefs. And when the same people create ignore lists which include most of the posters who do not agree with them, it is obvious that they do not use the ignore list to avoid "trolls" or whatever. They use it to avoid opinions and counterarguments, and do it by finding excuses to accuse posters that they are trolls or want attention because they are "special" or whatever. And it is this hypocrisy and intellectual cowardice which bothers me...And your posts, are a perfect demonstration of this attitude.
    Last edited by pamak; 07 Jul 18, 17:45.
    My most dangerous mission: I landed in the middle of an enemy tank battalion and I immediately, started spraying bullets killing everybody around me having fun up until my computer froze...

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    • #32
      Originally posted by craven View Post
      What I find interesting is the pro trump side has not even considered if maybe the dems are right and ICE does need to abolished and redone or tweaked.

      ICE is less than 18 years old and at it core was an anti terror creation.
      Okay, let's abolish ICE, but in return, Dems have to let Repubs abolish one department. For Repubs, I'm sure many are enthralled with the idea of abolishing IRS or FBI. We certainly don't need IRS, we were fine before IRS was created by a Democrat. Neither do we need FBI anyway, they don't really serve a useful purpose.

      Now you will say to me, no no no, don't abolish IRS or FBI. Then by golly, don't abolish ICE either!
      Major James Holden, Georgia Badgers Militia of Rainbow Regiment, American Civil War

      "Aim small, miss small."

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      • #33
        Originally posted by pamak View Post

        What special?

        Your question is a typical irrational excuse which people like you use when they want to justify why they need an echo-chamber. Did you ask conservative posters if they post here because they want other people to notice them because they are "special"? No!

        Why exactly do we participate in political forums? I think the obvious answer is because we want others to hear our thoughts! If it was not that, then we could as well start talking to a wall! It is to that it bother me if if somebody ignore me. It bothers me when somebody lives in that echo-chamber. It bothers me when somebody pretends that it is only the mainstream media of the adversary which propagate "fake news" and uses this BS excuse to justify his choice to only read media which propagate his political beliefs. And when the same people create ignore lists which include most of the posters who do not agree with them, it is obvious that they do not use the ignore list to avoid "trolls" or whatever. They use it to avoid opinions and counterarguments, and do it by finding excuses to accuse posters that they are trolls or want attention because they are "special" or whatever. And it is this hypocrisy and intellectual cowardice which bothers me...And your posts, are a perfect demonstration of this attitude.
        People like me? Im not the one that needs an echo chamber. That's you. That's why you're deeply offended by the concept of an ignore list.

        You're just a spoiled brat, jumping up and down demanding to be seen and heard.
        ALL LIVES SPLATTER!

        BLACK JEEPS MATTER!

        BLACK MOTORCYCLES MATTER!

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        • #34
          Originally posted by Gixxer86g View Post

          People like me? Im not the one that needs an echo chamber. That's you. That's why you're deeply offended by the concept of an ignore list.

          You're just a spoiled brat, jumping up and down demanding to be seen and heard.
          Now, you do to make sense. You make things up, and assumptions about what offends me without evidence just because you did not like the answer I gave you. I explained very rationally and with evidence who are the people who need an echo-chamber here. They have a pattern of behavior which is not just about how they react towards me. It is a general behavior which includes all the things I described earlier. And the common denominator in all these things is that they refuse to face opinions that they do not validate their beliefs. It is interesting though that my passing comment about the echo-chamber got so much attention. Normally, my comments do not elicit such responses from you. It seems for some reason you felt the need to defend yourself even though I did not mention your name specifically. It shows that deep inside you recognize that I make a valid point.
          My most dangerous mission: I landed in the middle of an enemy tank battalion and I immediately, started spraying bullets killing everybody around me having fun up until my computer froze...

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          • #35
            Originally posted by pamak View Post

            Now, you do to make sense. You make things up, and assumptions about what offends me without evidence just because you did not like the answer I gave you. I explained very rationally and with evidence who are the people who need an echo-chamber here. They have a pattern of behavior which is not just about how they react towards me. It is a general behavior which includes all the things I described earlier. And the common denominator in all these things is that they refuse to face opinions that they do not validate their beliefs. It is interesting though that my passing comment about the echo-chamber got so much attention. Normally, my comments do not elicit such responses from you. It seems for some reason you felt the need to defend yourself even though I did not mention your name specifically. It shows that deep inside you recognize that I make a valid point.
            Oh dear. You rarely make a valid point.

            ALL LIVES SPLATTER!

            BLACK JEEPS MATTER!

            BLACK MOTORCYCLES MATTER!

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            • #36
              Gixxer makes an interesting point. Why are you so insecure about ignore lists? I've never minded when liberals wanted to ignore me. But I personally never put you on ignore so once again we also have the strawman culture. Not that ignoring is a demand for an echo chamber anyway. It would depend on who gets put on ignore and why. If they are ignoring everyone who opposes them then that would be an echo chamber. Locking out a couple of trolls is somewhat less than total. However your echo chamber comment is a demonstrably proven element of strawman culture by virtue of the fact that Gixxer and myself are debating you. If we weren't comfortable with being challenged we wouldn't be here. Essentially declaring anyone who responds to you as desirous of an echo chamber is a laughable statement. It's one of those "let's think about this for a second" moments.
              Last edited by Pirateship1982; 08 Jul 18, 09:54.
              A new life awaits you in the off world colonies; the chance to begin again in a golden land of opportunity and adventure!

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              • #37
                Originally posted by Pirateship1982 View Post
                Gixxer makes an interesting point. Why are you so insecure about ignore lists? I've never minded when liberals wanted to ignore me. But I personally never put you on ignore so once again we also have the strawman culture. Not that ignoring is a demand for an echo chamber anyway. It would depend on who gets put on ignore and why. If they are ignoring everyone who opposes them then that would be an echo chamber. Locking out a couple of trolls is somewhat less than total. However your echo chamber comment is a demonstrably proven element of strawman culture by virtue of the fact that Gixxer and myself are debating you. If we weren't comfortable with being challenged we wouldn't be here. Essentially declaring anyone who responds to you as desirous of an echo chamber is a laughable statement. It's one of those "let's think about this for a second" moments.
                The question you ask s like asking me why I beat my wife. I did not say that everybody here needs an echo-chamber. The fact that you debate me about this issue, most probably shows that you felt the need to support the attitude of some of your buddies here. I do not make conclusion about you or Gixxer based simply on how you react to my post. When I talked about the type of conservatives who need an echo-chamber here I described a broader pattern of behavior which shows a lack of desire to face uncomfortable opinions of the other side. This is why many here tell us that they do not read MAINSTREAM media that do not support Trump, like WaPo, NYT, and CNN. Are you or GIxxer one of these guys who only read right wing sources? I do not know.,BUT I have READ posts from conservative posters here who openly admit that they do not read such sources, and when the same posters also avoid a debate not just with me but with many people here on the "left" then a clear pattern emerges that these posters WANT to live in an echo-chamber.


                Also, the fact that posters showed a clear frustration when the ignore list did not work here shows again that they feel uncomfortable when they hear information that contradicts their beliefs. Most normal people would not have a problem to just scroll down and ignore other people's posts until the ignore list will be fixed. When there were people attacking me for coming back here after my long term absence for professional reasons, followed by questions to the moderators about the ignore list (you and Gixxer were not among them), it was obvious that they were upset just because they read my posts. When conservative posters who claim that they have me on ignore list, intervene in conversations (which supposedly they cannot follow since they cannot read what I say) only to try to persuade other posters to stop "feeding the troll," it is obvious that we have posters whose mission appears to be the transformation of this forum to a comfortable echo-chamber for the conservatives here. And notice that living in an echo-chamber does not mean that somebody decided to avoid everybody who has an opposite views. If somebody from the opposite side is not wiling to push back to defend his position, or if he does not engage in conversations longer than a sentence or two, then such opposition is actually welcomed since it gives an opportunity for a comfortable debate which will not expose the gaps and weaknesses of someone's position. But if the opposition comes with a desire for a more serious conversation or debate then this interaction seems to be uncomfortable for many people here.
                Last edited by pamak; 08 Jul 18, 12:30.
                My most dangerous mission: I landed in the middle of an enemy tank battalion and I immediately, started spraying bullets killing everybody around me having fun up until my computer froze...

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                • #38
                  Originally posted by pamak View Post
                  the fact that posters showed a clear frustration when the ignore list did not work here shows again that they feel uncomfortable when they hear information that contradicts their beliefs.
                  No, just a frustration with liars and the general whining, that's all. If you would argue from a strong point and do so honestly, without resorting to the usual leftist tactics, you wouldn't be getting so much grief. You're a bit better than some, but you still fall into that category of screeching liberal. Give up the former part and things would be better for you here.
                  The First Amendment applies to SMS, Emails, Blogs, online news, the Fourth applies to your cell phone, computer, and your car, but the Second only applies to muskets?

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                  • #39
                    Well, I don't have a dog in this fight. I never put anyone on "ignore." I simply don't respond to stuff I deem unworthy of a response or simply don't think is worth my time to respond to.

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                    • #40
                      Originally posted by Hida Akechi View Post

                      No, just a frustration with liars and the general whining, that's all. If you would argue from a strong point and do so honestly, without resorting to the usual leftist tactics, you wouldn't be getting so much grief. You're a bit better than some, but you still fall into that category of screeching liberal. Give up the former part and things would be better for you here.

                      The irony in your post is incredible... You do not expose those liars with any information or sources you bring. You are just entering conversations WHINING that some people are whiners and lie. And apparently people should believe you because you are not a liar...
                      My most dangerous mission: I landed in the middle of an enemy tank battalion and I immediately, started spraying bullets killing everybody around me having fun up until my computer froze...

                      Comment


                      • #41
                        Originally posted by Cheetah772 View Post

                        Okay, let's abolish ICE, but in return, Dems have to let Repubs abolish one department. For Repubs, I'm sure many are enthralled with the idea of abolishing IRS or FBI. We certainly don't need IRS, we were fine before IRS was created by a Democrat. Neither do we need FBI anyway, they don't really serve a useful purpose.

                        Now you will say to me, no no no, don't abolish IRS or FBI. Then by golly, don't abolish ICE either!
                        I forget liberals like you want to keep government big

                        both organizations you listed are needed in there niche( although not sure about dealing with terrorism and law enforcement in the same shop. But how about department of Ed. Us conservatives like smaller government..

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                        • #42
                          I know what the Left would replace ICE with! A new cabinet level Department of Peace!

                          https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Department_of_Peace

                          The new agency would greet the great unwashed masses trampling across our borders, unchecked, by singing Kumbaya to them and handing out flowers and SNAP cards...

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