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  • slick_miester
    replied
    Originally posted by Cult Icon View Post
    It could help to know what "Marxism" is before one brainlessly uses the term to describe everything liberal
    Usually Marxism has something to do with Marx, or something inspired by Marx.

    I just can't recall if it was Karl or Zeppo . . . .

    Leave a comment:


  • Cult Icon
    replied
    It could help to know what "Marxism" is before one brainlessly uses the term to describe everything liberal

    Leave a comment:


  • slick_miester
    replied
    Originally posted by Mountain Man View Post

    And modest, as well...
    Are you suggesting that patriotic Americans were not obliged to learn all they could about their gravest enemy?

    Leave a comment:


  • Mountain Man
    replied
    Originally posted by slick_miester View Post

    Oh yeah. Read that crap years ago. I'm a firm believer in knowing my enemy better than he knows himself.
    And modest, as well...

    Leave a comment:


  • slick_miester
    replied
    Originally posted by Cult Icon View Post
    has any conservative (Marxist/ neo-Marxist) name dropper EVER read Marx?
    Oh yeah. Read that crap years ago. I'm a firm believer in knowing my enemy better than he knows himself.

    Leave a comment:


  • Mountain Man
    replied
    Originally posted by Cult Icon View Post
    the biggest trump fan on ACG should wear Trump/Lincoln as their avatar

    Go ahead. No one is stopping you.

    Leave a comment:


  • Cult Icon
    replied
    the biggest trump fan on ACG should wear Trump/Lincoln as their avatar

    Leave a comment:


  • Darth Holliday
    replied
    Originally posted by Cult Icon View Post
    has any conservative (Marxist/ neo-Marxist) name dropper EVER read Marx?
    Does Frederick Engels count...??

    Leave a comment:


  • Cult Icon
    replied
    has any conservative (Marxist/ neo-Marxist) name dropper EVER read Marx?

    Leave a comment:


  • T. A. Gardner
    replied

    Leave a comment:


  • Half Pint John
    replied
    Donald Trump backtracks on comments made during summit with Vladimir Putin

    https://globalnews.ca/news/4336619/t...=notification/

    Leave a comment:


  • Darth Holliday
    replied
    Originally posted by Mountain Man View Post
    What does any of this have to do with the topic of this thread?
    Amen brother....He just loves to cut and paste....

    Leave a comment:


  • pamak
    replied
    Originally posted by G David Bock View Post

    Marx's "philosophy" was that of a parasite. He never toiled on farm or in factory, etc. had had the view developed by one whom started supported by family and later his writing and teaching, etc. He did not come from working class nor was a part of it, so had a distorted view.

    His grasp of history seems to have resulted in some misconceptions as history shows that once civilization starts, humans sift into classes and specialized tasks. Once out of the "hunter-gatherer" stage the class distinction increases. Even in hunter-gatherer tribes there is a bit stratification in their society and they are often more a case of might equal right rather a democracy of sorts. Humans break out in a bell curve when it comes to skills and abilities, not all being equal in that sense, so some are more limited in "creativity" than others, and only in some cases will "creativity" pay and put food on the table. For the bulk of humanity it has been toil and drudge and often under the direction of others.

    Karl Marx, via Wiki;
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Karl_Marx
    You can believe whatever you want about Marx and his philosophy. My objective was not to persuade people to accept his philosophy or to believe that Marx was a saint or even a good guy. My point was to show that those who claim that the Marxist philosophy does not espouse a classless society, and those who believe that Marx supported slavery, express views that cannot be backed-up by anything that Marx wrote. This is why I challenged the quotes that appeared in this thread out of context by going to the original source to cite the whole paragraph, and this is why I found additional evidence from Marx's writing to show that he actually hated slavery. The fact that he was against people selling their labor to others does not make him a supporter of pro-slavery. His view was that everybody should be a master of his own labor and creativity and the mere act of selling an important characteristic of human nature creates a corrupt culture in which humans become "things." I do not know if Marx was a romantic fool or a good guy or a lazy intellectual, but I do know the basic tenets of his philosophy, and support of slavery or express hate or contempt for the working class is not part of his writing.

    PS By the way, many philosophers were "parasites" who often rejected material wealth and depended on their followers for assistance so that they can concentrate in their work. Even Socrates was philosophizing during his feasts with his wealthy friends. His relation to the aristocrat Plato was not that different to the relationship Marx had with Engels.
    Last edited by pamak; 16 Jul 18, 20:58.

    Leave a comment:


  • G David Bock
    replied
    Originally posted by pamak View Post

    My point is to put in the right place basic historical knowledge, and push back against people like you who come to a history forum with partial and misleading quotes to push their agenda. . And I do it by finding evidence and the context of such quotes. I just do not want certain members to feel that they can come here and claim whatever crazy claim comes to their mind without being challenged. On the other hand, I do understand MM's point that my conversation with ljadw is not related to the topic.

    And yes, Marx believed that working for someone else is slavery. The fact that you do not understand it, is because you cannot grasp the core basis of his philosophy. One of the main questions all philosophers since Socrates tried to answer is what it means to be a human. Different schools gave different answers to what the human nature is and as a result developed a different basis for their theory. Marx believed that what separates us from other forms of lives is our ability to create things through our work and make our thoughts part of the material world. Thus, for him, work is a sacred process and one who loses his ability to be creative through his work losses his humanity. So in his view one could not rent his human nature to a third person.
    Marx's "philosophy" was that of a parasite. He never toiled on farm or in factory, etc. had had the view developed by one whom started supported by family and later his writing and teaching, etc. He did not come from working class nor was a part of it, so had a distorted view.

    His grasp of history seems to have resulted in some misconceptions as history shows that once civilization starts, humans sift into classes and specialized tasks. Once out of the "hunter-gatherer" stage the class distinction increases. Even in hunter-gatherer tribes there is a bit stratification in their society and they are often more a case of might equal right rather a democracy of sorts. Humans break out in a bell curve when it comes to skills and abilities, not all being equal in that sense, so some are more limited in "creativity" than others, and only in some cases will "creativity" pay and put food on the table. For the bulk of humanity it has been toil and drudge and often under the direction of others.

    Karl Marx, via Wiki;
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Karl_Marx

    Leave a comment:


  • Mountain Man
    replied
    Originally posted by ljadw View Post
    Pamak Pamakovitch was reciting his usual marxist propaganda.He is not replying on the fact that the creator of Marxism , Karl himself, who was lying about a classless society and who said that working for someone else was slavery , was himself paying someone to serve him and to be ready when he had sexual desires .
    The motto of Marx was : listen to what I am saying, but don't look at what I am doing .
    AH...thank you for that clear and cogent explanation.

    Leave a comment:

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