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  • #31
    Obama was running for President. There are certain things candidates do, like it or not, to get votes. One is go all out on the national anthem and flag. You'd think his handlers would have known that.

    As for saluting "enemy" officers. That is protocol. You are saluting the rank, not the man even if the man has done horrible things or the uniform he wears represents what you see as evil. It's one of those "being the better person" things.

    So, you salute the rank and then tell him he's committed war crimes and will be shot in the morning...

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    • #32
      Correct. When I visited East Germany, I got stuck in the position of saluting a Russian general officer. Startled the crap out of him and the to East German officers escorting him, but it was the mandatory thing to do under the military code of conduct. It never occurred to me not to salute him.
      Quis Custodiet Ipsos Custodes? Who is watching the watchers?

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      • #33
        Originally posted by T. A. Gardner View Post
        Obama was running for President. There are certain things candidates do, like it or not, to get votes. One is go all out on the national anthem and flag. You'd think his handlers would have known that.

        As for saluting "enemy" officers. That is protocol. You are saluting the rank, not the man even if the man has done horrible things or the uniform he wears represents what you see as evil. It's one of those "being the better person" things.

        So, you salute the rank and then tell him he's committed war crimes and will be shot in the morning...
        So Obama bowing was ok

        as I said it nitpicking

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        • #34
          Originally posted by Mountain Man View Post
          Correct. When I visited East Germany, I got stuck in the position of saluting a Russian general officer. Startled the crap out of him and the to East German officers escorting him, but it was the mandatory thing to do under the military code of conduct. It never occurred to me not to salute him.
          yeah for the military I am fine with it. It just military curtesy and in another catergory. than interactions with a civilian. ie the president possibly

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          • #35
            Originally posted by Massena View Post
            The US was already great before Trump, and we will be after he leaves. He isn't helping 'greatness' at all and has diminished the office of president.
            .
            Right!


            Trying hard to be the Man, that my Dog believes I am!

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            • #36
              Originally posted by R.N. Armstrong View Post
              Actually, I think Trump is most like TR--both Populists, breaking the mold of a president. IMO TR would be a kindred soul with Trump.

              If we were so great before Trump, why are fixing wrecked national security issues, the economy, and in a cultural revolution?

              De Tocqueville is probably greater wisdom than Hubner.
              This is very true. And like Teddy, Trump is a man who has great success in the private sector.

              The cult of the mediocre that is the TDS crowd will never forgive Trump for being a success, nor for wanting America to be great.
              Any man can hold his place when the bands play and women throw flowers; it is when the enemy presses close and metal shears through the ranks that one can acertain which are soldiers, and which are not.

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              • #37
                Originally posted by R.N. Armstrong View Post

                What nonsense, did Lincoln serve his country in combat, police commissioner.... T
                He actually served during the Black Hawk War, though he didn't see any combat. And Trump isn't even close to Lincoln in character, ability, nor anything else.
                We are not now that strength which in old days
                Moved earth and heaven; that which we are we are; One equal temper of heroic hearts
                Made weak by time and fate but strong in will
                To strive to seek to find and not to yield.

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                • #38
                  Originally posted by craven View Post

                  yeah for the military I am fine with it. It just military curtesy and in another catergory. than interactions with a civilian. ie the president possibly
                  The US armed forces are required to salute their own officers and those of their allies-that's it. When I was a cadet at West Point in the mid-70s, there were visiting Soviet/Russian officers and when I passed them I did not salute them as they didn't rate it from US military personnel. The escort officer, a US Army field grade officer, stopped me and corrected me and I told him I was required to salute US and allied officers. And as the Soviets/Russians were not our allies, in point of fact our adversaries, I was not required to salute them. He looked at me and then told me I was correct.
                  We are not now that strength which in old days
                  Moved earth and heaven; that which we are we are; One equal temper of heroic hearts
                  Made weak by time and fate but strong in will
                  To strive to seek to find and not to yield.

                  Comment


                  • #39
                    Originally posted by Arnold J Rimmer View Post

                    This is very true. And like Teddy, Trump is a man who has great success in the private sector.

                    The cult of the mediocre that is the TDS crowd will never forgive Trump for being a success, nor for wanting America to be great.
                    Was Roosevelt ever sued, accused of fraud, under investigation by the FBI or now the attorney general of New York? Roosevelt was honest; Trump is not. And for that fact alone Trump is not a success no matter how much credit you want to give him for being rich. Don't be a lemming, but that might be too much to ask.
                    We are not now that strength which in old days
                    Moved earth and heaven; that which we are we are; One equal temper of heroic hearts
                    Made weak by time and fate but strong in will
                    To strive to seek to find and not to yield.

                    Comment


                    • #40
                      Originally posted by Massena View Post

                      Was Roosevelt ever sued, accused of fraud, under investigation by the FBI or now the attorney general of New York? Roosevelt was honest; Trump is not. And for that fact alone Trump is not a success no matter how much credit you want to give him for being rich. Don't be a lemming, but that might be too much to ask.
                      In America, everyone is innocent until proven guilty by the a jury of his peers. Until he or she has received due process, the accusations are nothing but allegations, and allegations can be false, mistaken, or made from jealous motives.

                      Being sued is hardly unusual in the real estate or construction businesses, where Trump made most of his billions. Nor is it unusual for the wealthy and big businesses to receive frivolous suits.

                      I'm an American, loyal to my country and its principles, but that is apparently too much to ask of some. A lifetime of failure turns people inward, making them petty, bitter, and inclined to resent & slander those who actually accomplished something in life.
                      Any man can hold his place when the bands play and women throw flowers; it is when the enemy presses close and metal shears through the ranks that one can acertain which are soldiers, and which are not.

                      Comment


                      • #41
                        Originally posted by Massena View Post

                        He actually served during the Black Hawk War, though he didn't see any combat. And Trump isn't even close to Lincoln in character, ability, nor anything else.
                        I'm sure you had a mental lapse; I compared Trump to TR. Lincoln was an example in response to your assertion of a President who was not in combat and I believe there are many more examples.
                        Leadership is the ability to rise above conventional wisdom.

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                        • #42
                          Originally posted by Arnold J Rimmer View Post

                          In America, everyone is innocent until proven guilty by the a jury of his peers. Until he or she has received due process, the accusations are nothing but allegations, and allegations can be false, mistaken, or made from jealous motives.

                          Being sued is hardly unusual in the real estate or construction businesses, where Trump made most of his billions. Nor is it unusual for the wealthy and big businesses to receive frivolous suits.

                          I'm an American, loyal to my country and its principles, but that is apparently too much to ask of some. A lifetime of failure turns people inward, making them petty, bitter, and inclined to resent & slander those who actually accomplished something in life.
                          with the exception of Hillary right

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                          • #43
                            Originally posted by craven View Post

                            So Obama bowing was ok

                            as I said it nitpicking
                            Sure. Never made a stink over that myself. This is nitpicking that was nitpicking. The only difference I can see is the press has out their tweezers and magnifying glass on Trump, while they were wearing dark glasses and blinders with Obama.

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                            • #44
                              Originally posted by R.N. Armstrong View Post
                              Actually, I think Trump is most like TR--both Populists, breaking the mold of a president. IMO TR would be a kindred soul with Trump.

                              If we were so great before Trump, why are fixing wrecked national security issues, the economy, and in a cultural revolution?

                              De Tocqueville is probably greater wisdom than Hubner.
                              Right now, one can also say that Trump is most like Nixon, both breaking the mold of a president. In truth however, it is just too early to make any such comparisons with other presidents.
                              By the way, since you are into strategy, do you think that America can become great again by starting a trade war against everybody? Because such COA seems irrational to me. Or do you think that such actions are just part of a bluff designed to intimidate others to let Trump do whatever is best for the US? We know that when politicians with big egos think that they can get away with such tactics, it usually ends bad for them and their nation. They may get some concessions in the beginning up until they develop a false sense of security and make the critical miscalculation to invade Poland literally or figuratively....
                              My most dangerous mission: I landed in the middle of an enemy tank battalion and I immediately, started spraying bullets killing everybody around me having fun up until my computer froze...

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                              • #45
                                Originally posted by Massena View Post
                                The US was already great before Trump
                                I don't know why conservatives don't like their country.
                                "Those who would give up Essential Liberty to purchase a little Temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety."
                                - Benjamin Franklin

                                The new right wing: hate Muslims, preaches tolerance for Nazis.

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