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  • The Case of the United States

    Has anyone read General Michael Hayden's new book The Assault on Intelligence?
    We are not now that strength which in old days
    Moved earth and heaven; that which we are we are; One equal temper of heroic hearts
    Made weak by time and fate but strong in will
    To strive to seek to find and not to yield.

  • #2
    Nah! But it seems that you have.....

    Paul
    ‘Tis said his form is tiny, yet
    All human ills he can subdue,
    Or with a bauble or medal
    Can win mans heart for you;
    And many a blessing know to stew
    To make a megloamaniac bright;
    Give honour to the dainty Corse,
    The Pixie is a little shite.

    Comment


    • #3
      Originally posted by Massena View Post
      Has anyone read General Michael Hayden's new book The Assault on Intelligence?
      Now that's funny right there....

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by Darth Holliday View Post
        Now that's funny right there....
        And why is that? Do you have or have you read the book?
        We are not now that strength which in old days
        Moved earth and heaven; that which we are we are; One equal temper of heroic hearts
        Made weak by time and fate but strong in will
        To strive to seek to find and not to yield.

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by Massena View Post
          Has anyone read General Michael Hayden's new book The Assault on Intelligence?

          Preaches to the Massena choir;
          QUOTE:
          About The Assault on Intelligence

          A blistering critique of the forces threatening the American intelligence community, beginning with the President of the United States himself, in a time when that community’s work has never been harder or more important

          In the face of a President who lobs accusations without facts, evidence, or logic, truth tellers are under attack. Meanwhile, the world order is teetering on the brink. North Korea is on the verge of having a nuclear weapon that could reach all of the United States, Russians have mastered a new form of information warfare that undercuts democracy, and the role of China in the global community remains unclear. There will always be value to experience and expertise, devotion to facts, humility in the face of complexity, and a respect for ideas, but in this moment they seem more important, and more endangered, than they’ve ever been. American Intelligence–the ultimate truth teller–has a responsibility in a post-truth world beyond merely warning of external dangers, and in The Assault on Intelligence, General Michael Hayden takes up that urgent work with profound passion, insight and authority.

          It is a sobering vision. The American intelligence community is more at risk than is commonly understood, for every good reason. Civil war or societal collapse is not necessarily imminent or inevitable, but our democracy’s core structures, processes, and attitudes are under great stress. Many of the premises on which we have based our understanding of governance are now challenged, eroded, or simply gone. And we have a President in office who responds to overwhelming evidence from the intelligence community that the Russians are, by all acceptable standards of cyber conflict, in a state of outright war against us, not by leading a strong response, but by shooting the messenger.
          ...
          https://www.penguinrandomhouse.com/b.../9780525558583


          Unfortunately, there are, have been, times when "intelligence community" is a classic oxymoron. The spooks are far from infallible and too often have gotten thinks wrong and/or late. Worst case is they have the highest level of hubris in thinking that citizens and taxpayers exist to serve them.
          TANSTAAFL = There Ain't No Such Thing As A Free Lunch

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          • #6
            I'm not impressed. Hayden is a political creature and currently works for CNN. He's been in the intelligence community for most of his life so he has an almost vested interest in defending it against criticism. I think it's likely his book is skewed to that position.

            Comment


            • #7
              So your answer to the OP is 'no.'

              Interesting that you condemn the book without reading it. Hayden has served the US faithfully and he takes to task those who deserve it, and praises those who deserve it. The comment that the intelligence community is a 'classic oxymoron' don't understand intelligence work and have had no experience in it, tactical or strategic. And Hayden is not a 'poltical creature' and he appears on more stations than CNN. He is a principal at the Chertoff Group, a distinguished visiting professor at George Mason University Schar School of Policy and Government and he founded the Hayden Center for Intelligence.
              We are not now that strength which in old days
              Moved earth and heaven; that which we are we are; One equal temper of heroic hearts
              Made weak by time and fate but strong in will
              To strive to seek to find and not to yield.

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by Massena View Post
                So your answer to the OP is 'no.'

                Interesting that you condemn the book without reading it. Hayden has served the US faithfully and he takes to task those who deserve it, and praises those who deserve it. The comment that the intelligence community is a 'classic oxymoron' don't understand intelligence work and have had no experience in it, tactical or strategic. And Hayden is not a 'poltical creature' and he appears on more stations than CNN. He is a principal at the Chertoff Group, a distinguished visiting professor at George Mason University Schar School of Policy and Government and he founded the Hayden Center for Intelligence.
                I've extensively read on military history over the past 50 + years. I have a huge personal library. I frequently go to book stores and can pretty much thumb through a volume now and tell you if it's worth reading. That is how I came to the conclusion I did. He's a political science professor. That's one of the least credible and easiest liberal arts degrees you can take in college today. His previous employment outside the military is with bonified Progressive companies. That he worked for CNN gives less, not more, credibility to him.

                I don't need to read his book to know my conclusions about its content and his position are wrong. His being a former General means little too. Most Generals (and Admirals) today are political creatures first, military officers second. Many have little or no experience related to actual warfare. We have this huge building full of that sort called the Pentagon.

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                • #9
                  Once again, critizing a book without reading it is meaningless. Whether or not you agree, the best thing to do is read it-then criticize to your heart's desire. General Hayden is an intelligence professional and not recognizing that fact is mystifying to say the least. It appears that you judge everything by politics, liberal, conservative, and not by what people have actually accomplished while serving their country. That you have a 'huge' personal library is nice, but what counts is what you have in your library, not how many. I have a good-sized personal library and had to build an addition to our home to house it. My library is overwhelmingly military history because that 's what I study, in three main areas of study. So what? That has nothing at all to do with reading about a book that is current regarding the defamation occurring about the US intelligence services by the current administration which is shameful and hurts the nation.
                  We are not now that strength which in old days
                  Moved earth and heaven; that which we are we are; One equal temper of heroic hearts
                  Made weak by time and fate but strong in will
                  To strive to seek to find and not to yield.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Would you need to read and study a flat earther's thesis before declaring him wrong?
                    A new life awaits you in the off world colonies; the chance to begin again in a golden land of opportunity and adventure!

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                    • #11
                      So now you're comparing senior intelligence officers to flat earthers? That makes no sense. Believe Trump and his minions but not solid professionals who have served this country loyally-something Trump does not understand.
                      We are not now that strength which in old days
                      Moved earth and heaven; that which we are we are; One equal temper of heroic hearts
                      Made weak by time and fate but strong in will
                      To strive to seek to find and not to yield.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by T. A. Gardner View Post

                        I've extensively read on military history over the past 50 + years. I have a huge personal library. I frequently go to book stores and can pretty much thumb through a volume now and tell you if it's worth reading. That is how I came to the conclusion I did. He's a political science professor. That's one of the least credible and easiest liberal arts degrees you can take in college today. His previous employment outside the military is with bonified Progressive companies. That he worked for CNN gives less, not more, credibility to him.

                        I don't need to read his book to know my conclusions about its content and his position are wrong. His being a former General means little too. Most Generals (and Admirals) today are political creatures first, military officers second. Many have little or no experience related to actual warfare. We have this huge building full of that sort called the Pentagon.
                        So, you don't really study Military History, you cherry pick history based on your beliefs.
                        Conservatives in the U.S. won't be happy until Jim Crow returns and "White Heterosexual Only" signs are legalized.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          John Brennan voted for the Communist party. If anything the Russians have infiltrated the CIA. Anyone who supports communism, or socialism (which liberals support as a pathway to communism) has on some level colluded with the Russians.
                          "It is a fine fox chase, my boys"

                          "It is well that war is so terrible-we would grow too fond of it"

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                          • #14
                            Nice dodge...and not reality.
                            We are not now that strength which in old days
                            Moved earth and heaven; that which we are we are; One equal temper of heroic hearts
                            Made weak by time and fate but strong in will
                            To strive to seek to find and not to yield.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by Massena View Post
                              Nice dodge...and not reality.
                              You. mean your reality... American87 is right on the money...Hayden is a never Trumper hardly bipartisan...Wonder how much CNN paid his advance...Hayden IS the sharpest tool in the shed, too bad ....

                              Comment

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