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What is Collusion?

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  • What is Collusion?

    It is not a federal crime, therefore Mueller has no legal grounds

    Stop using “collusion” as a short-hand for criminality’
    Paul Rosenzweig is former deputy assistant secretary for policy at the Department of Homeland Security and founder of Red Branch Consulting.
    Collusion is not a federal crime (except in the unique case of antitrust law), so we should all just stop using “collusion” as a short-hand for criminality. But that doesn’t mean that the alleged cooperation between the Trump campaign and Russia is of no criminal interest. To the contrary, if true, it may have violated any number of criminal prohibitions.

    For example, if Donald Trump Jr. sought “dirt” on Hillary Clinton from the Russians, he might be charged with conspiring to violate the election laws of the United States, which prohibit foreign nationals from contributing any “thing of value” to an electoral campaign. The opposition dirt is at least plausibly a thing of value. And to the extent that the Trump campaign aided, abetted or advised the Russians (or any other hackers) about what would be most useful to steal from the Democrats or how best to enhance the impact of their release, they may well have violated the Computer Fraud and Abuse Act.

    Of course, none of this excuses the apparent cover-up, which is often as bad as the original crime. Lying to the federal government in your registration forms or your security application is a false statement. Using the wires to perpetrate your crime is often wire fraud. In short, let’s stop talking about “collusion” and instead talk about real crimes that may, or may not, be proven—violations of election law, computer hacking, false statements and wire fraud.
    https://www.politico.com/magazine/st...llusion-215366
    Politics is the art of looking for trouble, finding it everywhere, diagnosing it incorrectly and applying the wrong remedies.

  • #2
    IN the article it states,
    For example, if Donald Trump Jr. sought “dirt” on Hillary Clinton from the Russians, he might be charged with conspiring to violate the election laws of the United States, which prohibit foreign nationals from contributing any “thing of value” to an electoral campaign. The opposition dirt is at least plausibly a thing of value.
    But both Hillary and Sanders had foreign nations working on their election committees, and we all know that Hillary hired GPS Fusion to contract with a foreign agent to go to Russia and fabricate dirt on Trump....
    Politics is the art of looking for trouble, finding it everywhere, diagnosing it incorrectly and applying the wrong remedies.

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    • #3
      I would go with it being short hand for a multitude of potential crimes. That leaves us with the legality of open ended investigations. I don't doubt that open ended investigations could be legal. My question is if they are legal if political motivated.

      It is time to fish or cut bait. Mueller is wasting taxpayers money and that is sufficient reason to shut him down. There are plenty of real criminals some of them in the democratic party that the resources would be better spent on.
      We hunt the hunters

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      • #4
        Originally posted by wolfhnd View Post
        I would go with it being short hand for a multitude of potential crimes. That leaves us with the legality of open ended investigations. I don't doubt that open ended investigations could be legal. My question is if they are legal if political motivated.

        It is time to fish or cut bait. Mueller is wasting taxpayers money and that is sufficient reason to shut him down. There are plenty of real criminals some of them in the democratic party that the resources would be better spent on.
        It is fact that the investigation has beyond a doubt proved that the Democratic candidate conspired with a former British intelligence agent to “dig dirt” on Trump.
        Politics is the art of looking for trouble, finding it everywhere, diagnosing it incorrectly and applying the wrong remedies.

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        • #5
          Originally posted by Urban hermit View Post
          It is not a federal crime, therefore Mueller has no legal grounds
          https://www.politico.com/magazine/st...llusion-215366
          I think "collusion" is meant to mean "conspired". The accusation is that the Russians acted illegally. If Trump "colluded" with the Russians, knew of their illegal acts, and aided them in any way, he could be guilty of "conspiracy"

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          • #6
            Originally posted by Work_permit View Post
            I think "collusion" is meant to mean "conspired". The accusation is that the Russians acted illegally. If Trump "colluded" with the Russians, knew of their illegal acts, and aided them in any way, he could be guilty of "conspiracy"
            Then why is Hillary not being investigated?
            Politics is the art of looking for trouble, finding it everywhere, diagnosing it incorrectly and applying the wrong remedies.

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            • #7
              Originally posted by Urban hermit View Post
              Then why is Hillary not being investigated?
              Because she's a Democrat and a female (aka, "minority"). That means she's allowed to do anything by any means to win in politics. Only Republican White males get excoriated for not following every rule and law scrupulously to the letter.

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              • #8
                Originally posted by Urban hermit View Post
                Then why is Hillary not being investigated?
                Ask the Justice Department.

                They are the ones who hired Mueller and gave him the mandate to investigate the Russian issue.
                We are not now that strength which in old days
                Moved earth and heaven; that which we are we are; One equal temper of heroic hearts
                Made weak by time and fate but strong in will
                To strive to seek to find and not to yield.

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                • #9
                  Originally posted by Massena View Post
                  Ask the Justice Department.

                  They are the ones who hired Mueller and gave him the mandate to investigate the Russian issue.
                  Would “the Russian” issue include the Russian who openly worked on Sanders campaign?
                  Politics is the art of looking for trouble, finding it everywhere, diagnosing it incorrectly and applying the wrong remedies.

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                  • #10
                    As a general rule, I never accept government or "official" definitions of specific terms, since they are subject to massive alteration whenever the need arises to spin something. "Collusion" is just one more example.
                    Quis Custodiet Ipsos Custodes? Who is watching the watchers?

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