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Who goes to jail as the result of the Trump-Russia collusion fraud?

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  • Originally posted by pamak View Post
    And a person chosen by Trump appointed Mueller. Your point?
    Trump didn't "choose" Rosenstein. He was next in line after Trump fired the first acting AG.

    Try to follow along at least with what you have posted...
    Originally posted by pamak View Post
    The ones of never criticizing the decision of the republicans to appoint a prosecutor with broad authorities to investigate Bill Clinton while criticizing Rosenstein for doing the same thing with Trump...
    Originally posted by The Doctor View Post
    A panel of Federal judges appointed Ken Starr.
    That same panel of judges approved every expansion of the probe away from Whitewater.

    While the old independent counsel statute was abysmal, at least the prosecutor was under the direct supervision of a panel of Federal judges. Republicans refused to renew the statute under which Starr was appointed and it went away in 1999.
    Watts Up With That? | The world's most viewed site on global warming and climate change.

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    • Originally posted by Daemon of Decay View Post
      But he has clearly defined authority to do so, does he not? He is looking into:
      (i) any links and/or coordination between the Russian government and individuals associated with the campaign of President Donald Trump; and
      (ii) any matters that arose or may arise directly from the investigation; and
      (iii) any other matters within the scope of 28 C.F.R. § 600.4(a).

      That's not "look for anything Trump or his people ever did wrong, ever".
      Originally posted by The Doctor View Post
      Mueller’s Marching Orders

      Under the law granting him legal authority (28 CFR 600), a special counsel is charged with investigating crimes. Only crimes. Nothing else. He has limited jurisdiction. Any other wrongdoing uncovered in the investigation which does not rise to the level of a criminal offense cannot even be made public by the special counsel. That is the law.

      So what crime is Mueller instructed to investigate? Let take a look.

      In his order appointing Mueller as special counsel (Order No. 3915-2017), Acting Attorney General Rod Rosenstein directed him to investigate “any links and/or coordination between the Russian government and individuals associated with the campaign of President Donald Trump”.

      But wait. If Mueller is supposed to look for evidence of a crime that is not, by legal definition, a crime…then isn’t the special counsel being asked to do something that is manifestly unattainable? Doesn’t the impossibility of his assignment render the exercise futile? The answer is yes. ]
      http://www.foxnews.com/opinion/2017/...not-crime.html
      § 600.1 Grounds for appointing a Special Counsel.
      The Attorney General, or in cases in which the Attorney General is recused, the Acting Attorney General, will appoint a Special Counsel when he or she determines that criminal investigation of a person or matter is warranted...
      https://www.law.cornell.edu/cfr/text/28/600.1

      What specific crime was Mueller tasked to investigate?
      What specific crime was Mueller tasked to investigate?
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      • Originally posted by The Doctor View Post
        The dossier is probably not driving Mueller's investigation, but it may have been used to obtain FISA warrants.
        Steele sent part of his "dossier" to American officials on June 20, 2016. It claimed that the Russians had been cultivating Trump "for at least 5 years," and that Manafort and Carter Page were the liasons between Trump and the Kremlin.

        In July the FBI, when it opened its investigation into Russian intervention, explicitly investigated Trump's involvement.
        Some sources say the motive for investigating Trump was that Carter Page gave a speech in Moscow that was critical of US foreign policy.
        At the same time, the FBI decided that Steele's "dossier" was credible and they met with him in August to ask him about his sources.
        "It is a fine fox chase, my boys"

        "It is well that war is so terrible-we would grow too fond of it"

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        • Originally posted by The Doctor View Post
          What specific crime was Mueller tasked to investigate?
          Although it was a buzz word earlier this year, the Logan Act has been mentioned before, but I also suspect they are leaning towards finding out if Trump/his staff are guilty of obstruction of justice in regards to the investigation of such ties in (i), as mentioned in (ii).

          I imagine that this also applies to any connections with the DNC emails and all that jazz, as related to the intelligence about Russia ties - a sort of a worked with b while b did something illegal to c scenario.

          But my point is less to do with those sorts of justifications but simply a look into what is required to make the special counsel inherently illegal, unconstitutional, or otherwise objectionable in a way that Trump could use if he desired to shut it down.

          One thing I was looking for was copies of previous such letters, but in the end I also wonder where it defines exactly where the guidelines for such a special counsel have to be laid out. Does the letter we’ve both posted have to include it by law? I ask because when dealing with the legal realm, following the letter of the law can be quite important.

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          • It looks like Mueller and his investigation has the White House in a panic over what to do next:

            https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/polit...cid=spartandhp
            We are not now that strength which in old days
            Moved earth and heaven; that which we are we are; One equal temper of heroic hearts
            Made weak by time and fate but strong in will
            To strive to seek to find and not to yield.

            Comment


            • Originally posted by The Doctor View Post
              Trump didn't "choose" Rosenstein. He was next in line after Trump fired the first acting AG.
              He had to go through a confirmation hearing from the Senate, and THAT Senate would not confirm somebody that Trump would not approve...


              https://www.politico.com/story/2017/...general-237600

              Rod Rosenstein was confirmed as the second-ranking official at the Justice Department on Tuesday, giving him the reins of the federal investigation into Russian interference in the 2016 election after Attorney General Jeff Sessions’ recusal last month.

              The Senate backed the veteran federal prosecutor as the nation’s deputy attorney general with a 94-6 vote. The chief complaint among the small group of Democrats who opposed Rosenstein was his reluctance to promise to appoint an independent prosecutor to lead the Russia probe.


              Originally posted by The Doctor View Post
              That same panel of judges approved every expansion of the probe away from Whitewater.

              While the old independent counsel statute was abysmal, at least the prosecutor was under the direct supervision of a panel of Federal judges. Republicans refused to renew the statute under which Starr was appointed and it went away in 1999.
              You sound like the democrats control now the process which, of course, is not the case. As you point out, if the statute went away because the republicans did not want to renew it, whose fault is this? And if anything, the current practice actually benefited Trump, at lest i the beginning because it gave him the opportunity to influence the investigation process as long as he had the spineless Sessions there. This is why Trump was pissed when Sessions recused himself. And by your own words, if the federal judges could expand the investigation and even follow completely different paths (since Monica had zero relationship to anything that triggered Clinton's first investigation) why are you complaining now about Rosenstein's decision with respect to Mueller's authority. It seems Rosenstein continues the practices of the past...
              Last edited by pamak; 02 Nov 17, 01:15.
              My most dangerous mission: I landed in the middle of an enemy tank battalion and I immediately, started spraying bullets killing everybody around me having fun up until my computer froze...

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              • It's a witch hunt. Fits pretty well into the pattern of the left's religious social justice hysteria mental melt down. They are speaking in tongues, dancing with venomous snakes and burning witches in the best traditions of all fundamentalist religions.
                We hunt the hunters

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                • Originally posted by wolfhnd View Post
                  It's a witch hunt. Fits pretty well into the pattern of the left's religious social justice hysteria mental melt down. They are speaking in tongues, dancing with venomous snakes and burning witches in the best traditions of all fundamentalist religions.
                  Absolute nonsense.

                  How is the Mueller and the FBI on the 'left?'

                  There have been two indictments and one 'flip' after a guilty plea, and it isn't over yet. In point of fact, the list of indictments is just beginning.

                  Are you just a Trumper who believes that he and his ilk can do no wrong? If so, then you are defending unethical and immoral behavior that is detrimental to the United States.
                  We are not now that strength which in old days
                  Moved earth and heaven; that which we are we are; One equal temper of heroic hearts
                  Made weak by time and fate but strong in will
                  To strive to seek to find and not to yield.

                  Comment


                  • Mueller and FBI are Deep State; after the election of Trump the direction of Deep State met at a Washington hotel under the chairmanship of Soros and they decided to destroy Trump, by all means,as befits Democrats .

                    The story was triumphantically made public by one of the websites of Deep State : Politico .

                    One of the (former ? ) collaborators of Mueller, Phill Mud ,said recently on the Deep State TV station (CNN): "Deep State is going to kill Trump ."

                    Dana Basher said the same .

                    Comment


                    • Originally posted by Massena View Post

                      In point of fact, the list of indictments is just beginning.
                      He receives his information from Mueller .

                      Comment


                      • The Mueller investigation is the same thing as Capone investigating Elliot Ness .

                        Comment


                        • Originally posted by wolfhnd View Post
                          It's a witch hunt. Fits pretty well into the pattern of the left's religious social justice hysteria mental melt down. They are speaking in tongues, dancing with venomous snakes and burning witches in the best traditions of all fundamentalist religions.
                          The foundations are panicking,they know that the average American no longer supports their tiranny. That's why one of their spokesmen, Bill Kristol, proposed to "replace " the "lazy white working-class "= the Trump voters, by immigrants . Which means : a cultural genocide .

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                          • Another one bites the dust...

                            https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/polit...cid=spartandhp

                            Unfortunately, he hasn't been indicted, but early days yet...
                            We are not now that strength which in old days
                            Moved earth and heaven; that which we are we are; One equal temper of heroic hearts
                            Made weak by time and fate but strong in will
                            To strive to seek to find and not to yield.

                            Comment


                            • Another 'big' surprise:

                              http://www.cnn.com/2017/11/01/opinio...tis/index.html
                              We are not now that strength which in old days
                              Moved earth and heaven; that which we are we are; One equal temper of heroic hearts
                              Made weak by time and fate but strong in will
                              To strive to seek to find and not to yield.

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by Massena View Post
                                In many places in Western Europe the discussion now seems to be to what extent Trump is more of an agent of a beginning process — or just a sign of one that has already been ongoing for a while — of a general US weakening...

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