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  • #16
    Originally posted by slick_miester View Post
    It's a root cause, but unfortunately it's a cause without remedy. The very factors that made Chicago a great city, that have made Chicago wealthy on transcontinental and international trade, ie its location between the Great Lakes and the Mississippi River, also make her attractive to gangsters and narco-traffickers. If it were possible to render Chicago unattractive for drug trafficking, she'd like be unattractive for any number of legal lines of business, as well.



    Long ago the authorities in Chicago decided not to fight the gangsters. It's been downhill ever since.

    What the Holy Roller Moral Majority crowd omits, however, is that it's their stupid laws that are making these troubles. Just like Prohibition turned street gangs into nationwide concerns, so too does the asinine "War on Drugs" turn otherwise insignificant street gangs into real economic powerhouses.

    And liberals are just as likely -- if not moreso -- to suffer from the delusion that new laws effect positive social change. Exhibit A: NYPD officers causing Eric Garner's death for selling untaxed loose cigarettes.



    You have no idea . . . .
    Are you saying we should legalize crack and heroin?
    "It is a fine fox chase, my boys"

    "It is well that war is so terrible-we would grow too fond of it"

    Comment


    • #17
      Originally posted by American87 View Post
      Are you saying we should legalize crack and heroin?
      Cocaine and and most opiates have been heavily restricted for better than a century. Crack was set aside for additional enforcement in the mid-1980s. Has any of that worked? Has recreational drug consumption moved much -- up or down -- away from the 15% mark in forty-some years? Did Prohibition reduce alcohol consumption?

      The notion that public policy should be based on 1) panic, and/or 2) the subjective morality of a braying mass is one that is clearly outdated, and had we any brains, we'd do away with it once and for all.
      I was married for two ******* years! Hell would be like Club Med! - Sam Kinison

      Comment


      • #18
        Originally posted by American87 View Post
        Trump called for action too. Didn't you watch the interview? The Democrats are leaving the cops out to dry because minorities don't like them, so they're afraid to do their job. Trump called for letting police do their job.

        Trump and the Fox News crowd have been covering this for a while. If you're interested you should check out what they have to say.
        "minorities don't like cops" is a gross generalization. Giving police military grade weapons or allowing them to pull people over without reason will not reduce crime. The problem is deeper than that. Right wing solution to everything is more violence. If a country doesn't like us, bomb them into oblivion. If there's crime, let the cops rough them up some more. Complex problems sometimes require complex solutions.

        Trump is also coming from a position of 'getting blacks in line' as opposed to ending senseless black deaths.
        "Those who would give up Essential Liberty to purchase a little Temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety."
        - Benjamin Franklin

        The new right wing: hate Muslims, preaches tolerance for Nazis.

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        • #19
          The drug debate is similar to the gun debate in the sense that more laws will not remove either from the streets.
          "Those who would give up Essential Liberty to purchase a little Temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety."
          - Benjamin Franklin

          The new right wing: hate Muslims, preaches tolerance for Nazis.

          Comment


          • #20
            There is a big difference : guns are neutral, drugs not .And, if there would be less drugs, there would be less guns .

            Comment


            • #21
              Originally posted by slick_miester View Post
              Cocaine and and most opiates have been heavily restricted for better than a century. Crack was set aside for additional enforcement in the mid-1980s. Has any of that worked?


              Has recreational drug consumption moved much -- up or down -- away from the 15% mark in forty-some years? Did Prohibition reduce alcohol consumption?

              .
              1) Yes :without the anti-drug laws,there would be more drugs .

              2) Alcohol is not a drug .

              Comment


              • #22
                Originally posted by TactiKill J. View Post
                The drug debate is similar to the gun debate in the sense that more laws will not remove either from the streets.
                The question should not be "how do we eliminate recreational narcotics," but how do we 1) reduce the numbers of people interested in using them, and 2) how do we reduce the harm caused by addiction. Elimination is not realistic: history has proven that abundantly. We've seen, through the uneven and at times asinine prosecution of the "War on Drugs," that we -- as a society -- have absolutely no intention of doing all it takes to eliminate recreational drugs from our society. If we were then roughly two-thirds of our prison population would be white -- and we've proven equally abundantly that there's no way we're willing to tolerate that. As it is, no shortage of law enforcement personnel have told me personally that "we can't arrest our way out of this problem." Let's be clear here: the law enforcement model of drug enforcement is a manifest failure. To insist on continuing in this vein is frankly evidence of insanity.
                I was married for two ******* years! Hell would be like Club Med! - Sam Kinison

                Comment


                • #23
                  Originally posted by TactiKill J. View Post
                  "minorities don't like cops" is a gross generalization. Giving police military grade weapons or allowing them to pull people over without reason will not reduce crime. The problem is deeper than that. Right wing solution to everything is more violence. If a country doesn't like us, bomb them into oblivion. If there's crime, let the cops rough them up some more. Complex problems sometimes require complex solutions.

                  Trump is also coming from a position of 'getting blacks in line' as opposed to ending senseless black deaths.
                  Where are you getting this BS?

                  The problem, at least the most important problem, is that police aren't doing investigative stops, because the locals hate them and the city doesn't have their back. Shootings have gone up 80% over the same period that investigative stops decreased 90%.
                  "It is a fine fox chase, my boys"

                  "It is well that war is so terrible-we would grow too fond of it"

                  Comment


                  • #24
                    Originally posted by slick_miester View Post
                    Cocaine and and most opiates have been heavily restricted for better than a century. Crack was set aside for additional enforcement in the mid-1980s. Has any of that worked? Has recreational drug consumption moved much -- up or down -- away from the 15% mark in forty-some years? Did Prohibition reduce alcohol consumption?

                    The notion that public policy should be based on 1) panic, and/or 2) the subjective morality of a braying mass is one that is clearly outdated, and had we any brains, we'd do away with it once and for all.
                    The only way we'll know if it worked is if we legalize those drugs and compare the stats. We can look at Colorado legalizing medical marijuana and see that yes, legalization/decriminalization does lead to higher drug use among adults https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/...eases-not-kids
                    "It is a fine fox chase, my boys"

                    "It is well that war is so terrible-we would grow too fond of it"

                    Comment


                    • #25
                      Originally posted by TactiKill J. View Post
                      The drug debate is similar to the gun debate in the sense that more laws will not remove either from the streets.
                      Actually, legalizing/decriminalizing marijuana has lead to an increase of usage by adults https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/...eases-not-kids

                      Whereas stricter gun laws do not reduce gun violence.
                      "It is a fine fox chase, my boys"

                      "It is well that war is so terrible-we would grow too fond of it"

                      Comment


                      • #26
                        Originally posted by ljadw View Post
                        2) Alcohol is not a drug .
                        Since when?

                        If it were not a drug, would their be a need for treatments for alcohol abuse? Becoming addicted where you have to have that drink no matter what? What about it's effect on the body? The brain damage? Being poisoned by drinking a bottle of everclear in one evening? The liver damage? Being intoxicated where you lose all control, either falling down drunk, or going into a fit of rage where you might kill someone and remember none of it when you sober up the next day?

                        There was even an amendment to the Constitution of the United States that prohibited the manufacture and consumption of alcoholic beverages. It was later repealed due to it being impossible to enforce.

                        At least nicotine, the addictive drug in smoking cigarettes, doesn't affect your thinking or behavior the way alcohol does.

                        Next to smoking cigarettes, alcohol is one of the most abused drugs out there. And, it's use is still legal providing you are over 21.
                        “Breaking News,”

                        “Something irrelevant in your life just happened and now we are going to blow it all out of proportion for days to keep you distracted from what's really going on.”

                        Comment


                        • #27
                          Originally posted by American87 View Post
                          Actually, legalizing/decriminalizing marijuana has lead to an increase of usage by adults https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/...eases-not-kids

                          Whereas stricter gun laws do not reduce gun violence.
                          Agreed. Weird that. The relaxation of the pot laws has lead to a reduction of crime here in CA as now its legal. Ponder that, narco gangs losing tons of $$$ and no longer are otherwise peaceful citizens fined or tossed into jail.

                          Liberty is a good thing.
                          Credo quia absurdum.


                          Quantum mechanics describes nature as absurd from the point of view of common sense. And yet it fully agrees with experiment. So I hope you can accept nature as She is - absurd! - Richard Feynman

                          Comment


                          • #28
                            Originally posted by SRV Ron View Post
                            Since when?

                            If it were not a drug, would their be a need for treatments for alcohol abuse? Becoming addicted where you have to have that drink no matter what? What about it's effect on the body? The brain damage? Being poisoned by drinking a bottle of everclear in one evening? The liver damage? Being intoxicated where you lose all control, either falling down drunk, or going into a fit of rage where you might kill someone and remember none of it when you sober up the next day?

                            There was even an amendment to the Constitution of the United States that prohibited the manufacture and consumption of alcoholic beverages. It was later repealed due to it being impossible to enforce.

                            At least nicotine, the addictive drug in smoking cigarettes, doesn't affect your thinking or behavior the way alcohol does.

                            Next to smoking cigarettes, alcohol is one of the most abused drugs out there. And, it's use is still legal providing you are over 21.
                            The moderate use of alcohol does not hurt one's health,while even a small use of LSD, heroin,can be deadly .

                            Alcohol is as food = neutral .Eating too much is also bad. But food is not a drug .

                            The prohibition had nothing to do with alcohol being bad for one's health .

                            Alcohol may be man's worst enemy, but the bible says :love your enemy (F.Sinatra )

                            Drink because you are happy,but never because you are miserable . (Chesterton ) .

                            Comment


                            • #29
                              Originally posted by SRV Ron View Post
                              Since when?

                              If it were not a drug, would their be a need for treatments for alcohol abuse? Becoming addicted where you have to have that drink no matter what? What about it's effect on the body? The brain damage? Being poisoned by drinking a bottle of everclear in one evening? The liver damage? Being intoxicated where you lose all control, either falling down drunk, or going into a fit of rage where you might kill someone and remember none of it when you sober up the next day?

                              There was even an amendment to the Constitution of the United States that prohibited the manufacture and consumption of alcoholic beverages. It was later repealed due to it being impossible to enforce.

                              At least nicotine, the addictive drug in smoking cigarettes, doesn't affect your thinking or behavior the way alcohol does.

                              Next to smoking cigarettes, alcohol is one of the most abused drugs out there. And, it's use is still legal providing you are over 21.
                              Since at least the "Last Supper" If it was good for Christ then it must be good for us.


                              going into a fit of rage where you might kill someone
                              With you CCP gun/guns of choice no less.
                              "Ask not what your country can do for you"

                              Left wing, Right Wing same bird that they are killing.

                              you’re entitled to your own opinion but not your own facts.

                              Comment


                              • #30
                                Originally posted by Bwaha View Post
                                Agreed. Weird that. The relaxation of the pot laws has lead to a reduction of crime here in CA as now its legal. Ponder that, narco gangs losing tons of $$$ and no longer are otherwise peaceful citizens fined or tossed into jail.

                                Liberty is a good thing.
                                Grow it, sell it, tax it and cut into the drug cartels money and fewer in our jails is all a win-win..
                                "Ask not what your country can do for you"

                                Left wing, Right Wing same bird that they are killing.

                                you’re entitled to your own opinion but not your own facts.

                                Comment

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