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Monuments and Statues Thread - Defacement, Protection, Removal and Discussion

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  • The same kids that were beaten up on the playground have now become important.

    My worst jump story:
    My 13th jump was on the 13th day of the month, aircraft number 013.
    As recorded on my DA Form 1307 Individual Jump Log.
    No lie.

    ~
    "Everything looks all right. Have a good jump, eh."
    -2 Commando Jumpmaster

    Comment


    • Originally posted by slick_miester View Post
      If you mean "Continental US soil," then no, Columbus never set foot on American soil. If, however, you mean the continents of North or South America, then yes, Columbus did set foot on American soil, during his fourth and final voyage, he came ashore at modern Panama and Honduras.



      And the Portuguese, and the French, and the Dutch, and the British . . . .

      And I'm not so sure that Columbus was Genovese. I'm leaning on Catalan but the jury's still out.



      You know it's funny, but as bad as the Spanish Conquistadors were -- and they were plenty bad, no doubt about it -- I've never once heard one of those La Raza dingdongs express a longing to return to Aztec governance. I winder why . . . .
      I've been wondering "why" about that a lot more for many years.
      Quis Custodiet Ipsos Custodes? Who is watching the watchers?

      Comment


      • Originally posted by Massena View Post
        You need to get over it, pick up the shattered pieces of your life, and move on.
        Making false accusations about people isn't necessary and is quite out of line. You should amend your posting and apologize to me.
        John

        Play La Marseillaise. Play it!

        Comment


        • He demands them but will not hand them out, don't waste your time.

          Originally posted by JBark View Post
          Making false accusations about people isn't necessary and is quite out of line. You should amend your posting and apologize to me.
          My worst jump story:
          My 13th jump was on the 13th day of the month, aircraft number 013.
          As recorded on my DA Form 1307 Individual Jump Log.
          No lie.

          ~
          "Everything looks all right. Have a good jump, eh."
          -2 Commando Jumpmaster

          Comment


          • Originally posted by Bass_Man86 View Post
            Moreover, I will opine that the monuments and the Confederate battle flag are minor portion of what is still the larger issue.
            While they are not the main issue they show that many people which to carry/show flags and put up or protect established monuments as representations of racism and promotion of white supremacy. I feel we must not allow this as it is plain wrong and is not what this country should stand for.

            Originally posted by Bass_Man86 View Post
            Specifically, that to this day a lot of white people believe that the Civil War was about state's rights rather than about slavery even though seven of the nine states that originally seceded specifically cited opposition to slavery as the primary reason for secession. Until we make it clear to our children that Civil War was unquestionably about slavery rather than states rights, we will continue to have these discussions.
            There can be no question of the importance of this, your point is correct. Gettysburg can give an accurate depiction of of the battle fought there, the troops that were lost and the terrible cost to humanity caused by this war. The site should, in my thinking, be a reminder that the southern troops had left the Union, that their actions started a terrible war and the battlefield was an invasion of the Union by the secessionists. Statues typically are erected to honor people; men fighting for slavery should not be honored. I know no other sane way to look at this. My thinking is that statues anywhere in this country of Jefferson Davis on down to a rebel private honor them and praise the sacrifice they made. We should not keep such statues up.
            Last edited by JBark; 22 Aug 17, 23:40.
            John

            Play La Marseillaise. Play it!

            Comment


            • Originally posted by jonny87kz View Post
              ... The southern states set them up in memory of the heroic sacrifice of their sons.
              This doesn't tell you something?

              Originally posted by jonny87kz View Post
              Those boys gave their last full measure of devotion to a cause they believed in. It may have been a terrible cause, but their sacrifices at least earned them the right to a stone monument on the field they bleed on.
              It was a horrible cause. They broke from the union over it...left this country and took up arms against it. They invaded the Union and were attempting to crush the Union. Yes, they gave their lives for this horrible cause and attempt to destroy the Union, please don't tell me I have to do more than give them a civil grave.

              Originally posted by jonny87kz View Post
              On a broader scale, I support leaving monuments to the Confederacy up. They serve as a reminder of the past with all its warts.
              I'm pretty sure this can be done without putting up statues. I recall the museum there as a very sobering reminder of a horrible time in our history and I fully understood all who participated and why they fought.[/QUOTE]

              Originally posted by jonny87kz View Post
              They also serve as a warning to us about the potential terrible results of not remembering we are all Americans and what can happen if we are not able to work out our differences peacefully.
              You have this incorrect, from my standpoint. The people that fought at Gettysburg were not "all Americans" as the south had seceded from the union.
              John

              Play La Marseillaise. Play it!

              Comment


              • Originally posted by JBark View Post
                Making false accusations about people isn't necessary and is quite out of line. You should amend your posting and apologize to me.
                You're the one who made the way-out-of-line comment about 'racist cretins' or was that the other JBark?
                We are not now that strength which in old days
                Moved earth and heaven; that which we are we are; One equal temper of heroic hearts
                Made weak by time and fate but strong in will
                To strive to seek to find and not to yield.

                Comment


                • Originally posted by JBark View Post
                  While they are not the main issue they show that many people which to carry/show flags and put up or protect established monuments as representations of racism and promotion of white supremacy. I feel we must not allow this as it is plain wrong and is not what this country should stand for.



                  There can be no question of the importance of this, your point is correct. Gettysburg can give an accurate depiction of of the battle fought there, the troops that were lost and the terrible cost to humanity caused by this war. The site should, in my thinking, be a reminder that the southern troops had left the Union, that their actions started a terrible war and the battlefield was an invasion of the Union by the secessionists. Statues typically are erected to honor people; men fighting for slavery should not be honored. I know no other sane way to look at this. My thinking is that statues anywhere in this country of Jefferson Davis on down to a rebel private honor them and praise the sacrifice they made. We should not keep such statues up.
                  I am a bit more ambivalent about statues than you are simply because the nagging question that keeps coming up in my mind is at what point do we stop? The founding fathers were almost uniformly slave owners so do we stop honoring them as well? The issue is hardly black and white, no pun intended. Lyndon Johnson did more for civil rights than most people realize but he certainly maintained what would be considered bigoted and racist views, yet he still signed a number of significant pieces of civil rights legislation.

                  I personally believe that if those monuments are placed in a proper context they actually serve a purpose. In the end history must be taught correctly and there can be no ambiguity about the Civil War being a conflict between the forces that opposed slavery and forces that wished to perpetuate it, not state's rights.
                  Last edited by Bass_Man86; 23 Aug 17, 11:10.
                  Give me a fast ship and the wind at my back for I intend to sail in harms way! (John Paul Jones)

                  Initiated Chief Petty Officer
                  Hard core! Old School! Deal with it!

                  Comment


                  • Originally posted by JBark View Post
                    While they are not the main issue they show that many people which to carry/show flags and put up or protect established monuments as representations of racism and promotion of white supremacy. I feel we must not allow this as it is plain wrong and is not what this country should stand for.



                    There can be no question of the importance of this, your point is correct. Gettysburg can give an accurate depiction of of the battle fought there, the troops that were lost and the terrible cost to humanity caused by this war. The site should, in my thinking, be a reminder that the southern troops had left the Union, that their actions started a terrible war and the battlefield was an invasion of the Union by the secessionists. Statues typically are erected to honor people; men fighting for slavery should not be honored. I know no other sane way to look at this. My thinking is that statues anywhere in this country of Jefferson Davis on down to a rebel private honor them and praise the sacrifice they made. We should not keep such statues up.
                    Then if that actually occurs, and it definitely should not, what's next? What is then banned? The National Battlefield Parks are fine as they are and if you don't like them there, don't visit the Parks.
                    We are not now that strength which in old days
                    Moved earth and heaven; that which we are we are; One equal temper of heroic hearts
                    Made weak by time and fate but strong in will
                    To strive to seek to find and not to yield.

                    Comment


                    • Originally posted by 101combatvet View Post
                      The same kids that were beaten up on the playground have now become important.

                      Thanks for posting this, another terror group, just what we needed.
                      Politics is the art of looking for trouble, finding it everywhere, diagnosing it incorrectly and applying the wrong remedies.

                      Comment


                      • Should make it open season on these idiots.

                        Originally posted by Urban hermit View Post
                        Thanks for posting this, another terror group, just what we needed.
                        My worst jump story:
                        My 13th jump was on the 13th day of the month, aircraft number 013.
                        As recorded on my DA Form 1307 Individual Jump Log.
                        No lie.

                        ~
                        "Everything looks all right. Have a good jump, eh."
                        -2 Commando Jumpmaster

                        Comment


                        • Originally posted by 101combatvet View Post
                          Should make it open season on these idiots.
                          I think that's what they want, not that there's anything wrong with that,
                          It seems that is the current goal of many of these alt Left terrorist groups, they will continue to destroy monuments and burn our flag not because they want to protest, but because they want to destroy our nation.
                          Clearly stated in the video you shared, they want to rid the world of whites,
                          And destroy all evidence we ever existed.
                          Politics is the art of looking for trouble, finding it everywhere, diagnosing it incorrectly and applying the wrong remedies.

                          Comment


                          • I don't agree with JBark on the statue thing, but he has the right to an opinion. I feel many "Lone Confederate" monuments would benefit if a statue to Union veterans was put beside it. It would be up to the donor if the Union veteran was White or Black.

                            Pruitt
                            Pruitt, you are truly an expert! Kelt06

                            Have you been struck by the jawbone of an ASS lately?

                            by Khepesh "This is the logic of Pruitt"

                            Comment


                            • Originally posted by Urban hermit View Post
                              I think that's what they want, not that there's anything wrong with that,
                              It seems that is the current goal of many of these alt Left terrorist groups, they will continue to destroy monuments and burn our flag not because they want to protest, but because they want to destroy our nation.
                              Clearly stated in the video you shared, they want to rid the world of whites,
                              And destroy all evidence we ever existed.
                              If they want war, let us give them war.
                              Quis Custodiet Ipsos Custodes? Who is watching the watchers?

                              Comment


                              • If they start messing with National Battlefields, that is my violence trigger.

                                Comment

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