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Trump budget keeps pledges: Cuts for poor, more for military

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  • #31
    The most effective way to trap squirrels is to put a Rat Trap out of reach of dogs and cats and put some peanut butter on it. My Grandmother had some fruit trees in her back yard that hardly ever bore any fruit. The Squirrels would cut them before the fruit was ripe! I told her about the Rat Traps. She got flustered and said her neighbor would not allow her to thin the population. I told her it was her property and as long as one was not shooting something dangerous she could do as she pleased. Grandmother was put in a nursing home later in life and she died while being evacuated for Hurricane Rita. The new owners cut down the fruit trees... I guess the Squirrels learned to eat other stuff.

    Pruitt
    Pruitt, you are truly an expert! Kelt06

    Have you been struck by the jawbone of an ASS lately?

    by Khepesh "This is the logic of Pruitt"

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    • #32
      Originally posted by Arnold J Rimmer View Post
      I've met countless homeless 'veterans' in the last thirty years. Two actually served. One was Section 8 out of Basic. The other had a general discharge and was an addict.
      The department of Veterans affairs estimated that on any given night there are approximately 76,000 homeless veterans. That's on a given night. It's estimated that upwards of 500,000 vets are homeless at some point during the year.

      1.5 million vets are considered at-risk of homelessness.

      Research shows that the greatest risk factors for homelessness are lack of support and social isolation after discharge.

      Maybe you met more than you realize or cared to realize.
      Conservatives in the U.S. won't be happy until Jim Crow returns and "White Heterosexual Only" signs are legalized.

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      • #33
        Originally posted by Anthrax View Post
        The department of Veterans affairs estimated that on any given night there are approximately 76,000 homeless veterans. That's on a given night. It's estimated that upwards of 500,000 vets are homeless at some point during the year.

        1.5 million vets are considered at-risk of homelessness.

        Research shows that the greatest risk factors for homelessness are lack of support and social isolation after discharge.
        Right up until you note this little gem:

        The U.S. Department of Veterans Affairs (VA) has committed to ending homelessness among veterans by 2015. In measuring progress toward this goal, researchers have used data on self-reported veteran status collected from adults in the homeless population through surveys and administrative data on homeless services use. However, these self-report data have not been cross-referenced with military or veteran records, and the validity of using these data for estimating the homeless population size is unknown.
        https://nursing.osu.edu/assets/attac...opulations.pdf

        Then to that I'd add if you didn't check the person's service record, even if they were verified a veteran by other means, you'd very likely determine that many of these "veterans" are in name only. That is, they served less than their full term of service, were first term enlistees, and had a service record that included one or more serious infractions of military law. While most might not be felons, the infractions could include serious drug use, problems with alcohol, or repeat disciplinary problems.

        Their "lack of support / social isolation" is due mainly to the above. If you are a general screw-up, marginally employable at best, and have a fouled up DD 214 as a result then you are unlikely to do well in the civilian world. You can top that off by likely lying to your prospective employer about why you left the service. On that one, I've heard some of the most incredible tales of fiction from these losers.

        I for one, and I'll bet that most, if not the vast majority of, veterans who served honorably would consider this sort of "veteran" to not be one or consider them worth wasting benefits on. Sure, there's exceptions in the above, but they are the few and far between.

        Maybe the VA and other homeless advocacy groups should start by doing a far better job of sorting through who's being called a "veteran" and homeless first.

        Maybe you met more than you realize or cared to realize.
        Yea, in my career(s) I've met more than a few and the vast majority fit the above description. Went in a E-1, spent more time on restriction or in the brig than working, got repeated substandard evaluations, was a problem for the unit they were assigned to, then finally discharged an E-1 long before their contract was up.
        With one exception, in 23 years working for the DoJ and BOP, I met exactly one (1) felon / inmate who was a veteran and didn't screw up in the above manner.

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        • #34
          Originally posted by Anthrax View Post
          Navy SEAL training does include survival training. While I don't think there is a module on squirrel trapping, there is on how to trap. In fact, survival training is also taught to pilots along with escape and evasion.
          First, you have to volunteer for BUDS / SEAL training after completing boot camp. You need to have an assigned rating and be at least an E-3. That means you need a fairly high ASVAB score and had gotten in the service with an advanced rank of E-2 or 3 and a guaranteed A school that you completed.
          Even then, the training doesn't include silliness like how to trap and eat squirrel. I've known a number of actual EOD / SEALs, officer and enlisted. You don't get in that program and end up a homeless derelict eating squirrel.

          And there are thousands of homeless veterans most with honorable discharges.
          Prove that. The VA in counting homeless "veterans" relies almost entirely on self-reporting.

          I think that for you automatically 'assume' this man had a Less Than Honorable discharge, is pretty disrespect full of veterans in general. Once again, you draw conclusions based on no facts. See a poor person= must be lazy. See a poor person with a color TV= must be gaming the system. See one person actually gaming the system=they all must be gaming the system.
          I do for two reasons: I served 27 years and know quite a bit about what types get early discharges and don't do well out of the military, and I also have civilian side experience with what sort end up being unable to do well as civilians.


          I mean Jesus ****ing Christ, all you have to do is do a quick internet search to discover homeless veterans is a systemic problem in the United States and it's for a multitude of reasons. I'm not saying this guy in the article is or is not a veteran or even what his discharge status is, but to automatically assume he has a Other Than or Less Than honorable discharge is just downright disrespectful of all the homeless men and women who have sacrificed so much to ensure your safety.
          All I have to do is see that the VA, and homeless advocacy groups rely on self-reporting to tell me what I need to know. How many homeless guys are going to lie to you to get you to give them a dollar? If they think saying they're a veteran will improve their chances, you can bet your @$$ they're going to tell you they're one.
          I can actually ask someone a handful of questions and PDQ tell if they're lying about being a veteran or not. It isn't that hard to do.

          While it's a movie, it's more true than most would like to admit...

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          • #35
            Originally posted by T. A. Gardner View Post
            First, you have to volunteer for BUDS / SEAL training after completing boot camp. You need to have an assigned rating and be at least an E-3. That means you need a fairly high ASVAB score and had gotten in the service with an advanced rank of E-2 or 3 and a guaranteed A school that you completed.
            I spent 20 years as a member of the intelligence branch of the navy, and have worked alongside seals (not in the field) so I know what it takes to be a SEAL.
            Originally posted by T. A. Gardner View Post
            Even then, the training doesn't include silliness like how to trap and eat squirrel. I've known a number of actual EOD / SEALs, officer and enlisted.
            First, I didnít say it included that training, I said they teach survival training. And how do you know there isnít a homeless SEAL? Did you go ask them? Once again, you are just making assumptions with no evidence to back it up. You just throw out a bunch of ďitís their faultĒ crap.
            Hereís a stat for you. Only 10% of all Vets living on the street have other than honorable discharges according to a national database on homeless vet maintain by Community Solutions. Hereís another stat. In 2013 there were 58,000 homeless vets. So, that means that in 2013 there were 52,000 vets with honorable discharges homeless. Even in it was 20 or 30 that is way too many vets, regardless of status.

            Originally posted by T. A. Gardner View Post
            You don't get in that program and end up a homeless derelict eating squirrel.
            Oh Really?

            http://www.sandiegouniontribune.com/...htmlstory.html
            Conservatives in the U.S. won't be happy until Jim Crow returns and "White Heterosexual Only" signs are legalized.

            Comment


            • #36
              I think you have to take everyone on an individual basis. I was in the Army less than six months. My knees swelled up and an Army Doctor asked me if I wanted to get out. I got out. The State of Louisiana says I am not a Veteran because I was not in for six months. They may know more about it than me, but why did I get a nice little certificate from President Ford saluting me as a Veteran?

              I have had a mixed employment record since. The strange thing is I owned my own house from 1986 to 2011. I lost my job and could not get another job. Nobody wanted to hire my old crippled body. I may be only 63 but parts of me feel like they are in my 80's! Now I have disability and live with family. If something happened to my family, I could be out on the streets! This is something I look forward to as I age more. I don't know if any of my Grandsons could afford to keep me. I learned a long time ago that it did me no good to say I was a veteran. At least I went in!

              Pruitt
              Pruitt, you are truly an expert! Kelt06

              Have you been struck by the jawbone of an ASS lately?

              by Khepesh "This is the logic of Pruitt"

              Comment


              • #37
                Originally posted by Arnold J Rimmer View Post
                As usual, you miss the point entirely.

                What I want would benefit the USA. The DNC will not address the budget as it needs to be. A GOP majority will not do as well as they need to, but they will do much better than the DNC.

                The USA has a serious problem with social spending. It is unsustainable. They can cut education grants and the student loans, kill NASA and trim defense, but sooner or later there will simply be insufficient funds for the programs currently in place.

                The way to do it is to cut programs incrementally over time, much like using methadone to wean a junkie off heroin. Not eliminate social spending all together, but to cap it at controllable levels.

                With proper oversight you could help the exact same number of needy currently being helped for 50% of the outlay, and still provide lots of pointless Federal jobs. If you forced the Feds to meet the standards they set for NGOs, you could do it for 25% of the current cost, which would easily be sustainable.

                If NGO standards were applied, you could feed and house every unwanted child and impoverished adult for 40% of the current budget.

                As it is, the poor in America suffer because the programs are being bled to death long before they reach their level.
                The irony.

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                • #38
                  Originally posted by Grognard Gunny View Post
                  It IS a bit of a bitch when the only way you can cut anything is to cut your own throat.

                  As soon as you try to cut "welfare" (and associated programs), the lib media will cut to a "weeping woman" segment in which a "WW" tells us (in no uncertain terms) how cutting (inset here, WW's favorite program) will put her and ALL her children (Can't forget the children, good for background and additional tears.) in the poorhouse.

                  On the other hand, you are written off as a hard ass, a soulless type, a bigot, a reactionary..... name your favorite nasty name here.

                  Damned if you do, damned if you don't. I do hasten to point out to all you hand wringers, that if the government keeps on this course, there will be no "giver of the goodies" to draw off of. Then we will all be the same...... broke and then we help no one.

                  Do look at the words of Mr. Chamberlain in my footnotes. Is there someone(s) in our society who takes without giving to the society? I suspect that there is.

                  GG
                  The problem is that there is a refusal to truly accept what need to be done.

                  Trump is making some bold moves to slash public spending and slow the slide towards financial ruin - but like all Republicans, he can't avoid using some of the money he "saved" on other, more GOP friendly programs, thus reducing the benefit of his cuts in the first place.

                  And hardest of all is that neither side can truly ever fix the problem satisfactorily because the biggest component - the economy - is out of their control.

                  Both the Dems and GOP have an ideology that works if the economy is strong enough. If there are jobs being made and wages are rising, then either one can justify their positions. The problem is getting there - and both sides will demonized their opponents as being the root cause of why the economy isn't as strong as it should be.

                  Venezuela is a good example: as long as the economy is rosy, you can justify just about wherever policies and programs you like. But once things turn sour and you need to make cuts... well, it's a hard genie to put back in the bottle.

                  Whether it's cutting welfare programs to single mothers, or slashing jobs in armament plants to working dads, making cuts is costly and will hurt people. Both sides avoid the hard logic there because it would cost them politically to do so. Both sides don't do what truly needs to be done because it would be too expensive and is so dependent on factors out of their control.

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