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Trump's war on crime, let's do this

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  • #16
    Originally posted by andrewza View Post
    MS13 is a third word gang in a first world country. Sure people will replace them but they wont be near the same level of vilonce.
    Getting rid of them is extremely tough under a POTUS who favors illegals over citizens.
    Any man can hold his place when the bands play and women throw flowers; it is when the enemy presses close and metal shears through the ranks that one can acertain which are soldiers, and which are not.

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    • #17
      Originally posted by The Exorcist View Post
      Well, let's hold his feet to the fire, then.

      Ignoring everything every wrong done by Politician with the right Letter next to his name is what the OTHER guys do.
      I keep hearing this 'hold his feet to the fire' comment.

      What fire? We haven't been able to do that with Bobo.

      The simple fact is that these problems have been building for decades, and no one action will stop them.

      You want to impact crime in a meaningful way, create private sector jobs.

      Drug use will drop, crime of all sorts will recede slowly.

      Drug use thrives in the dysfunctional portions of society, as does other crime. As the pool of people raised without hope grows, crime grows, and no amount of enforcement or legalization or criminalization will impact that in any significant way.

      Tere is no quick fix. Even if the jobs flood in tomorrow, it will be years before we see an impact. It will most certainly get worse; if jobs are created it might get better with time.
      Any man can hold his place when the bands play and women throw flowers; it is when the enemy presses close and metal shears through the ranks that one can acertain which are soldiers, and which are not.

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      • #18
        Originally posted by Bwaha View Post
        You guys are forgetting the three hundred pound gorilla.

        What do these people do for money? Sell drugs. If you took them out you'd just get another gang coming in to take their place.

        Perhaps we should rethink the 'war on drugs'. I'm not saying total legalization for everything, but what we're doing now is and has been a total failure...
        Some form of legalization should definitely be part of the solution. The Mexican drug cartels make billions in drug trade ($6b according to RAND), how would cutting that much from them not have a significant impact on their operations?

        As long as there is money to be made more will be recruited in. It has to be a two-pronged approach.
        "Those who would give up Essential Liberty to purchase a little Temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety."
        - Benjamin Franklin

        The new right wing: hate Muslims, preaches tolerance for Nazis.

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        • #19
          Originally posted by Arnold J Rimmer View Post
          I keep hearing this 'hold his feet to the fire' comment.

          What fire? We haven't been able to do that with Bobo.

          The simple fact is that these problems have been building for decades, and no one action will stop them.

          You want to impact crime in a meaningful way, create private sector jobs.

          Drug use will drop, crime of all sorts will recede slowly.

          Drug use thrives in the dysfunctional portions of society, as does other crime. As the pool of people raised without hope grows, crime grows, and no amount of enforcement or legalization or criminalization will impact that in any significant way.

          Tere is no quick fix. Even if the jobs flood in tomorrow, it will be years before we see an impact. It will most certainly get worse; if jobs are created it might get better with time.
          Jobs won't do anything in this regard. The type of people dealing drugs are typically unqualified for any well paying job to begin with. So it would be extremely naive to expect them to give up 6 figures a year dealing drugs to work for minimum wage instead. Won't happen.

          Also, drugs are used by the poor and affluent alike, it's the poor that typically get caught and punished though.
          "Those who would give up Essential Liberty to purchase a little Temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety."
          - Benjamin Franklin

          The new right wing: hate Muslims, preaches tolerance for Nazis.

          Comment


          • #20
            Originally posted by Bwaha View Post
            You guys are forgetting the three hundred pound gorilla.

            What do these people do for money? Sell drugs. If you took them out you'd just get another gang coming in to take their place.

            Perhaps we should rethink the 'war on drugs'. I'm not saying total legalization for everything, but what we're doing now is and has been a total failure...
            Originally posted by TactiKill J. View Post
            Some form of legalization should definitely be part of the solution. The Mexican drug cartels make billions in drug trade ($6b according to RAND), how would cutting that much from them not have a significant impact on their operations?

            As long as there is money to be made more will be recruited in. It has to be a two-pronged approach.
            How would making it legal cut of the catals money?
            you think you a real "bleep" solders you "bleep" plastic solders don't wory i will make you in to real "bleep" solders!! "bleep" plastic solders

            CPO Mzinyati

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            • #21
              Originally posted by TactiKill J. View Post
              Some form of legalization should definitely be part of the solution. The Mexican drug cartels make billions in drug trade ($6b according to RAND), how would cutting that much from them not have a significant impact on their operations?

              As long as there is money to be made more will be recruited in. It has to be a two-pronged approach.
              THen why not just negotiate with the drug cartels to buy drugs at market price and then destroy the drugs?
              Dispite our best intentions, the system is dysfunctional that intelligence failure is guaranteed.
              Russ Travers, CIA analyst, 2001

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              • #22
                Originally posted by Bwaha View Post
                You guys are forgetting the three hundred pound gorilla.

                What do these people do for money? Sell drugs. If you took them out you'd just get another gang coming in to take their place.

                Perhaps we should rethink the 'war on drugs'. I'm not saying total legalization for everything, but what we're doing now is and has been a total failure...
                Completely agree for a change!!!
                Give me a fast ship and the wind at my back for I intend to sail in harms way! (John Paul Jones)

                Initiated Chief Petty Officer
                Hard core! Old School! Deal with it!

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                • #23
                  Originally posted by TactiKill J. View Post
                  Some form of legalization should definitely be part of the solution. The Mexican drug cartels make billions in drug trade ($6b according to RAND), how would cutting that much from them not have a significant impact on their operations?

                  As long as there is money to be made more will be recruited in. It has to be a two-pronged approach.

                  Legalization does not mean that the drug cartels would make less billions: they still would have the monopoly and would continue fixing prices .

                  There would be not less drugs sold if drugs were legalized .

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                  • #24
                    Originally posted by ljadw View Post
                    Legalization does not mean that the drug cartels would make less billions: they still would have the monopoly and would continue fixing prices .

                    There would be not less drugs sold if drugs were legalized .
                    It's impossible to completely eliminate anything, but they will most certainly make less. This is a given and already proven by the few states that have legalized marijuana. If you're a law abiding citizen why would you go buy weed from dangerous gang members when you no longer have to...
                    "Those who would give up Essential Liberty to purchase a little Temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety."
                    - Benjamin Franklin

                    The new right wing: hate Muslims, preaches tolerance for Nazis.

                    Comment


                    • #25
                      Originally posted by TactiKill J. View Post
                      Jobs won't do anything in this regard. The type of people dealing drugs are typically unqualified for any well paying job to begin with. So it would be extremely naive to expect them to give up 6 figures a year dealing drugs to work for minimum wage instead. Won't happen.

                      You're quite mistaken on this on two counts. 1) The type that turns to dealing drugs CAN become qualified for a well paying job. They choose not to. And 2) Only the top tier of drug traffickers make 6 figures a year. The vast majority of your street level dealers can maintain themselves somewhere around or just above the poverty line with dealing.....many of them improve their lifestyle to working class by abusing the Welfare system.

                      Also, drugs are used by the poor and affluent alike, it's the poor that typically get caught and punished though.
                      It's the poor that typically do user/dealer sort of things.

                      Your affluent users buy dope, use dope. Their only occasions to get caught are in the initial purchase, and the transporting of a personal use quantity of dope (many times a misdemeanor) home.....the law prevents the kicking of random doors to find dope.

                      Your poor users often can't afford to support their habit. This leads them to get caught while shoplifting, burglarizing, prostituting, and other sorts of crimes. They also get caught while doing favors for their dealers like muling dope, or performing street level sales of their own to pay for their habit. They're far more likely to be caught with felony levels of dope.
                      Tacitos, Satrap of Kyrene

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                      • #26
                        I think that ending sanctuary cities is a necessity, if you order LE to ignore illegals you just empower them to break further laws.
                        Credo quia absurdum.


                        Quantum mechanics describes nature as absurd from the point of view of common sense. And yet it fully agrees with experiment. So I hope you can accept nature as She is - absurd! - Richard Feynman

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                        • #27
                          Originally posted by TacCovert4 View Post
                          It's the poor that typically do user/dealer sort of things.

                          Your affluent users buy dope, use dope. Their only occasions to get caught are in the initial purchase, and the transporting of a personal use quantity of dope (many times a misdemeanor) home.....the law prevents the kicking of random doors to find dope.

                          Your poor users often can't afford to support their habit. This leads them to get caught while shoplifting, burglarizing, prostituting, and other sorts of crimes. They also get caught while doing favors for their dealers like muling dope, or performing street level sales of their own to pay for their habit. They're far more likely to be caught with felony levels of dope.
                          Yes, so what I initially said was accurate. Everyone uses, but the poor are the ones being caught most often.

                          Of course dealers don't want to take the effort of doing what's right to get and maintain a well paying job, that's why they're out dealing drugs. Anyone could become qualified for anything if the desire is there. Creating more jobs is not going to change that. Also, good luck getting these guys that only speak ebonics english a good job regardless of the circumstances.

                          Anyone else notice how there's a new ebonics word being created almost every month. Soon enough it will have to recognized as its own language. How about learning standard English before creating your own ghetto dialect.
                          Last edited by TactiKill J.; 13 Dec 16, 15:26.
                          "Those who would give up Essential Liberty to purchase a little Temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety."
                          - Benjamin Franklin

                          The new right wing: hate Muslims, preaches tolerance for Nazis.

                          Comment


                          • #28
                            Originally posted by ljadw View Post
                            Legalization does not mean that the drug cartels would make less billions: they still would have the monopoly and would continue fixing prices .

                            There would be not less drugs sold if drugs were legalized .
                            Nor would addicts quit stealing to serve their habits.

                            Legalization of pot has certainly empowered the cartels.
                            Any man can hold his place when the bands play and women throw flowers; it is when the enemy presses close and metal shears through the ranks that one can acertain which are soldiers, and which are not.

                            Comment

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