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  • Originally posted by Arnold J Rimmer View Post
    The CNN poll, if it was taken, and if it was honestly reported (two things CNN isn't known for) was less that 25% of a usual political poll pool.

    425 instead of a minimum pool of 2000k.
    Sorry, your figures are completely wrong. There are many, many more polls on the RCP list with fewer than 1000 respondents than with anywhere near 2000.

    You were also out by 25% with the number of people in the poll - it was 521, not 425. So, it was about 50% of the size of most polls, which means a bigger margin of error.

    It certainly isn't the best piece of data we will see this week or even necessarily accurate, but it is light years ahead of the self-selecting online 'polls' the Daily Mail was so keen on. We now know those were swamped by Trump supporters, so the results are hardly a surprise.
    Human beings are the only creatures on Earth that claim a god and the only living thing that behaves like it hasn't got one - Hunter S. Thompson

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    • Originally posted by ljadw View Post
      Michael Moore said that Trump won the debate .
      Moore is a professional liar. Anyone who takes anything he says seriously only does so for partisan political reasons.
      Human beings are the only creatures on Earth that claim a god and the only living thing that behaves like it hasn't got one - Hunter S. Thompson

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      • Originally posted by Persephone View Post
        THIS ^ kind of feedback matters more to me than polls.
        Youngstown PA population 200.
        "Ask not what your country can do for you"

        Left wing, Right Wing same bird that they are killing.

        you’re entitled to your own opinion but not your own facts.

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        • Originally posted by BF69 View Post
          Moore is a professional liar.

          And supports Hillary .

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          • Originally posted by ljadw View Post
            And supports Hillary .
            ....while Ann Coulter writes books about Trump. All candidates have unsavoury hangers on.
            Human beings are the only creatures on Earth that claim a god and the only living thing that behaves like it hasn't got one - Hunter S. Thompson

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            • They're celebrating at Hillary's campaign HQs:

              "I'm a bitch, I'm a bitch oh, the bitch is back
              Stone cold sober as a matter of fact
              I can bitch, I can bitch 'cause I'm better than you
              It's the way that I move, the things that I do oh

              Bitch, bitch, the bitch is back
              Bitch, bitch, the bitch is back"
              {}

              "Any story sounds true until someone tells the other side and sets the record straight." -Proverbs 18:17

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              • Originally posted by BF69 View Post
                Moore is a professional liar. Anyone who takes anything he says seriously only does so for partisan political reasons.
                Already? The "anyone who believes anything is crazy/racist/partisan/whatever?" argument so early in the discussion?

                Well...anyone who says that is obviously highly bigotted themselves...right? Especially towards America?


                You might want to rethink your approach while you look for solid evidence that Moore is a liar who is paid professionally to do it. Looking forward to your "evidence".
                Quis Custodiet Ipsos Custodes? Who is watching the watchers?

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                • Originally posted by Mountain Man View Post
                  Already? The "anyone who believes anything is crazy/racist/partisan/whatever?" argument so early in the discussion?

                  Well...anyone who says that is obviously highly bigoted themselves...right? Especially towards America?


                  You might want to rethink your approach while you look for solid evidence that Moore is a liar who is paid professionally to do it. Looking forward to your "evidence".
                  WOW, MM defending Moore Is the sun going to come up tomorrow? Well Ron get to use his bunker.

                  Having friends point out defects and problems is what friends are for, at least imo. We have no problem pointing out the same problems in other country's. Do you operate on a double standard? Foolish question.

                  bigoted MM You fit that definition as well as anyone here at ACG.
                  "Ask not what your country can do for you"

                  Left wing, Right Wing same bird that they are killing.

                  you’re entitled to your own opinion but not your own facts.

                  Comment


                  • Originally posted by BELGRAVE View Post
                    Ah, you've discerned that too.
                    The Reds clearly sabotaged Mr Trump's microphone and notice the colour of Mrs Clinton's suit: no need to speculate who pulls her strings !
                    The Indians? Clinton seems to favor those nerhu jackets lately... Of course, it could be she's channeling the 60's...

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                    • Originally posted by Mountain Man View Post
                      Already? The "anyone who believes anything is crazy/racist/partisan/whatever?" argument so early in the discussion?

                      Well...anyone who says that is obviously highly bigotted themselves...right? Especially towards America?


                      You might want to rethink your approach while you look for solid evidence that Moore is a liar who is paid professionally to do it. Looking forward to your "evidence".
                      Do you actually know who Michael Moore is? I'm not convinced you do, but its amusing to see you reflexively defend a known left wing liar simply because he says Trump won the debate.

                      Moore's 'documentaries' are littered with falsehoods & misrepresentations. its what he does for a living. For some reason moronic left wingers think that is OK because 'the other side does it too'. Personally I stopped treating him as a reliable source after watching Bowling for Columbine. The implication that the banning of the KKK & the founding of the NRA were linked stood out at the time. Other falsehoods have become clear subsequently. His other work isn't any better.
                      Human beings are the only creatures on Earth that claim a god and the only living thing that behaves like it hasn't got one - Hunter S. Thompson

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by Half Pint John View Post
                        WOW, MM defending Moore Is the sun going to come up tomorrow? Well Ron get to use his bunker.

                        Having friends point out defects and problems is what friends are for, at least imo. We have no problem pointing out the same problems in other country's. Do you operate on a double standard? Foolish question.

                        bigoted MM You fit that definition as well as anyone here at ACG.
                        Human beings are the only creatures on Earth that claim a god and the only living thing that behaves like it hasn't got one - Hunter S. Thompson

                        Comment


                        • Originally posted by Daemon of Decay View Post
                          I'm waiting till later today before breaking out the big list of lies. Hillary was your standard politician - evasive, bland, refusing to give concrete answers unless they contained some nugget to be used in an attack. In other words, your standard Washington performance.

                          Trump though... Trump lied outright three or four times off the top of my head.

                          So while Clinton was vapid enough to avoid making large lies - again, SOP for Washington is to talk a lot while saying nothing of substance, and Hillary embodies that - Trump dove right on into them. I mean, usually politicians will tell half-lies and manipulate data to suit their needs. Trump had a couple of blatant lies that were just stunning. Absolutely stunning.

                          I fear that there isn't a conservative or liberal in this nation with any real moral fiber these days.
                          I agree with ya on this one Trump just outright makes stuff up or uses facts from way out there or denies he did or said something and bam there is a tweet by him or something else.

                          while Hillary just uses typical politico speak.

                          and that why Trump is getting hammered for needing to be fact checked all the time.

                          Comment


                          • Originally posted by T. A. Gardner View Post
                            Hillary's public service record is one of failures, scandals, and inaction. How does that equate to experience I should consider valuable?
                            Scandals? She's gone to jail? Been impeached? No. You WANT to believe a lot of made up crap because you are insecure about a woman as president. Her experience is tremendous but you want to hold her to a standard no one has ever been held to to get this office. I have no idea what you consider valuable but I'm sure your standard would be impossible for any woman or democrat to reach.

                            Originally posted by T. A. Gardner View Post
                            What exactly did she accomplish as Secretary of State? What as a Senator? Even her First Lady version of Obamacare was an unmitigated disaster.
                            I'm sure you would dismiss anything I responded with and I'm equally sure you have no idea what she did or didn't do in office.

                            Originally posted by T. A. Gardner View Post
                            He's clearly a conspiracy nutter on the issue, but racist? No.
                            So we want a conspiracy nutter as president...really? Let's remember this conspiracy has been fed by him FOR YEARS. Kept alive FOR YEARS. Long after the BC was produced (how many presidents face this type of request?) he continued to press the issue. FOR YEARS!

                            Originally posted by T. A. Gardner View Post
                            Show where his taking on this issue was on the basis of race.
                            You know for a fact that it was not racial, right? He didn't question what else might be on the BC, like religion (Hint, hint...muslim.) Yes, he did. So if one attacks the first black candidate/president and questions where he might have been born, questions what information might have been on the BC like Muslim religion, I think most people will look at this as a racial attack. You don't want to so you will not but if you add this to his numerous ethnic attacks and slurs it fits the profile.

                            Originally posted by T. A. Gardner View Post
                            And, you're right, this is a complete non-issue at this point. Hillary's team is bringing it up as a Red Herring argument Trump should ignore.
                            Trump wants it to disappear because it makes him look like an ass. He only gave it up a week or so ago and then lied to blame it on Clinton. It is an issue because it shows his true diseased make up and that he wants to not be held accountable for his wrongs. Not only does he not want to be held accountable but he is willing to lie about Clinton pursuing this topic. Very much like a child caught with his hand in the cookie jar, saying he didn't do it and blaming his sibling. No Red Herring here, just pure sickness.

                            Originally posted by T. A. Gardner View Post
                            Here he pointed out many companies beside his were sued. It was on of those typical sue everybody and let's get a settlement. Most of the companies were dropped out of the suit as it progressed, as was Trump's. Again, a red herring argument based on innuendo.
                            No red herring. His father's companies (which he worked for and enforced its policies) discriminated against blacks and were charged by the feds. Did you see him deny the practices? Did you see him say he was not guilty. No, he simply said many companies were sued. Hmm, sounds like an admission of guilt to me but he just thinks its OK. That's the racist in him. (Btw, because people with big money get lawyers to get them off in court does not mean they were not guilty, you know this as well as I.)

                            Originally posted by T. A. Gardner View Post
                            Lying, whatever. He has several marathons worth of distance to catch up with Hillary in this respect. Everything that comes out of her mouth is suspect at this point she's lied so often and for so long, on everything she gets involved with.
                            If you do some checking you will see that Trump is way ahead of him in the lying department and she actually stands out as one of the most accurate of all candidates in this election. Of course you want to avoid the issue, he lied when the issue of his support of the Iraq invasion came up. Evidence of his support has been shown for a long time and he, ridiculously and childishly, stood there and denied it over and over again. Surprised he didn't hold his breath and have a fit.

                            Originally posted by T. A. Gardner View Post
                            Not compared to Hillary's. She flat out called him a racist repeatedly without evidence. She all but called him misgynological, and during the entirety of the debate kept up those mocking and dismissive facial expressions.
                            He is a racist and only someone with their head in the sand or that wants to deny their own racism would deny it. He is clearly a misogynist and sexist. Again denying this is ridiculous. You may have been on another planet for the last several months but Donald Trump has shown the world that U.S. the presidential has changed. It is now permissable to be a bully, a name caller, a racist, a sexist and lie at almost every turn. Trump plays the game of blaming the media for every ridiculous or disgusting remark he makes, from attacking veterans and gold star families to recommending violence against his candidates. I find it unbelievable that our population has sunk that low in the numbers they have but fear, prejudice and ignorance will do that. I love the way he and his propaganda team are doing their best to spread the word about what he didn't say. One of the most disgusting displays I've ever seen and the absolute beauty of it is that he has cheated on his wives...but that is okay. Laughable, just laughable, if it were not during a presidential race.

                            Originally posted by T. A. Gardner View Post
                            Lucky for Hillary Trump didn't go on the attack on cybersecurity...
                            I'm sure it will be covered and I would think both sides would be ready to handle it.

                            You've obviously been taken in by Trump and his version of Joseph Goebbels, et al. (Who is worse among the Trump minions? Christie, Guiliani or Kellyanne Conway?) You somehow ignore his "relationship" with Putin and Russia, our enemy on this planet in most people's minds. You ignore every wrong this man commits, blame it on the media because you've been told to ignore racism because you are one and will never accept Clinton simply because she is a woman. Btw, have you heard the good news? Trump announced that he won the debate, just check the CBS poll. Aw, too bad he forgot, there wasn't one.
                            Last edited by JBark; 29 Sep 16, 00:04.
                            John

                            Play La Marseillaise. Play it!

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                            • Originally posted by Bass_Man86 View Post
                              If true, it proves that she was smart enough to do it away from the camera and the microphones. Why don't you forward this to the Donald, maybe he will take the hint.
                              So what you're saying is, it's okay to be a jerk and treat people who can't defend themselves like ****, as long as nobody gets it on tape?

                              Comment


                              • Late to the party, I just watched the full debate.

                                Clinton was the more polished performer, as you would expect from a former lawyer. I also felt the questions played to her strengths. Immigration is a top issue and it was not discussed or fed as a question, yet we got a question from the host about Obamas birth certificate. I felt there was subltle bias in the questioning in favour of Clinton.

                                As the more natural debator, Clinton probably got the upper hand on scoring specific point against Trump, however I still think she lost for two reasons. Firstly, as someone in a position of power for a long time, she has ownership of many of the problems Trump raised. Secondly, I think people are tiring of professional politicians who put on a good media show but don't deliver for the people. A polished debating performance is not the asset it used to be. People are angry and it doesn't look like Clinton gets it. She may pay for that.
                                Ne Obliviscaris, Sans Peur

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