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The Donald’s Net Favourability Rating Among Hispanics: -51%

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  • Escape2Victory
    replied
    Originally posted by BF69 View Post
    Dear me! quite the dramatic, aren't we? Last time I checked Hispanics speak 'Western' languages & follow 'Western' religions. Like most people obsessed with odd notions about 'Western' culture & non-whites, you are completely missing the point. The reason Hispanic voters have a problem with the GOP isn't because they want to flood America with other Hispanics. The reason they have a problem with the GOP is because they want to be accepted as Americans and behind the anti-immigration rhetoric they see more sinister attitudes to non-whites. Advocates of laws that essentially treat all Hispanics as presumed criminals until proven otherwise (and there are plenty of them) tell Hispanic Americans that they aren't viewed as 'real' Americans. People like Trump & his supporters confirm this. You only have to see people on this forum rushing to defend his statements about 'thieves & murderers' to see the problem.....well, some of us can see it.

    Here is the really stupid thing & the thing you clearly don't understand - it has been widely recognized for decades that Hispanics should be a natural GOP constituency. They are more religious than the mainstream & are much more socially conservative than the mainstream. On both counts they are an odd fit for the Democrats. After all, appealing to 'cultural conservatives' was one of the winning strategies of Ronald Reagan. There are other ways in which they better fit the Dems, but as a whole they should be 'up for grabs'. Even more so as they move more into the middle class. They fit 'Western culture' pretty damned well, as it happens. Yet the GOP is so busy pitching to angry & prejudiced white folks it is missing the opportunity to grab a growing demographic.

    Conservative parties in Australia screwed up similarly with Vietnamese migrants in the 1970s & 80s and lost a generation who should have been natural conservative voters. Pandering to narrow nativist views is stupid politics, but conservatives seem unable to help themselves.
    Remind me again how you described your sentiments on mass migration to the west - "it makes me grin from ear to ear" I believe. You will forgive me if I don't take your attempts to play honest broker, rational voice of reason, too seriously.

    The charge against Hispanic immigration is that it brings a high risk of violence, especially sexual violence against women because that culture places a low value on women in society. From what I have seen of the data, the charge stands and that will be a concern to more than 'angry old white men', as you are now learning from poll data.

    Leave a comment:


  • Jonathanrex1
    replied
    Originally posted by Escape2Victory View Post
    Going on the media images, admittedly not an especially scientific approach, the Trump support is broad in age, if not in race.
    I beg to differ.

    The Donald's most recent and largest rally in Alabama – where 31.5% of the population is Non-White – looked like Scandinavia.









    Okay, the last one was just for fun, but you get my point.

    Leave a comment:


  • BF69
    replied
    Originally posted by Escape2Victory View Post
    You may be right, I don't know for sure. If the US has reached the point the Hispanic vote has the deciding say on Hispanic immigration, that would appear the beginning of the end of western culture in the US, as we have known it in the past. It will slowly change and become something different in the decades ahead. We shall have to see if that is what happens.
    Dear me! quite the dramatic, aren't we? Last time I checked Hispanics speak 'Western' languages & follow 'Western' religions. Like most people obsessed with odd notions about 'Western' culture & non-whites, you are completely missing the point. The reason Hispanic voters have a problem with the GOP isn't because they want to flood America with other Hispanics. The reason they have a problem with the GOP is because they want to be accepted as Americans and behind the anti-immigration rhetoric they see more sinister attitudes to non-whites. Advocates of laws that essentially treat all Hispanics as presumed criminals until proven otherwise (and there are plenty of them) tell Hispanic Americans that they aren't viewed as 'real' Americans. People like Trump & his supporters confirm this. You only have to see people on this forum rushing to defend his statements about 'thieves & murderers' to see the problem.....well, some of us can see it.

    Here is the really stupid thing & the thing you clearly don't understand - it has been widely recognized for decades that Hispanics should be a natural GOP constituency. They are more religious than the mainstream & are much more socially conservative than the mainstream. On both counts they are an odd fit for the Democrats. After all, appealing to 'cultural conservatives' was one of the winning strategies of Ronald Reagan. There are other ways in which they better fit the Dems, but as a whole they should be 'up for grabs'. Even more so as they move more into the middle class. They fit 'Western culture' pretty damned well, as it happens. Yet the GOP is so busy pitching to angry & prejudiced white folks it is missing the opportunity to grab a growing demographic.

    Conservative parties in Australia screwed up similarly with Vietnamese migrants in the 1970s & 80s and lost a generation who should have been natural conservative voters. Pandering to narrow nativist views is stupid politics, but conservatives seem unable to help themselves.

    Leave a comment:


  • Escape2Victory
    replied
    Originally posted by BF69 View Post
    I'm sure that if the GOP can't pull something close to 40% of the Hispanic vote it is going down....unless there is a truly spectacular implosion on the other side.

    Trump is doing such a good job for the Dems that you could make an argument that he is trying to win the election for them (the argument would be wrong, but defensible). The Dems couldn't construct a 'get out the vote' campaign for Hispanic voters a fraction as powerful as having a guy who makes nasty comments about them & has a Spanish speaking news anchor dragged out of one of his press conferences lead polls of GOP voters. That moron snarling 'get out of my country' is a poster boy for every white nativist.

    Meanwhile the candidates who are actually running for President can't get arrested & can't get out any other message. If Trump wasn't already so rich Hilary would probably offer to pay him to stay in the race all the way to the convention. If he & others like him get a spot on the podium at the convention you won't be able to hear the crowd baying over the sound of the GOP bleeding votes.
    You may be right, I don't know for sure. If the US has reached the point the Hispanic vote has the deciding say on Hispanic immigration, that would appear the beginning of the end of western culture in the US, as we have known it in the past. It will slowly change and become something different in the decades ahead. We shall have to see if that is what happens.

    Leave a comment:


  • Gixxer86g
    replied
    Where I live is a strong Costa Rican community. A huge number of these folks are customers, coworkers, and friends.

    Strangely enough, a lot of these folks like Trump.

    A lot are scared as well. For some reason they're convinced Trump will be President.

    I guess it depends on immigration status.

    Leave a comment:


  • BF69
    replied
    Originally posted by Escape2Victory View Post
    Going on the media images, admittedly not an especially scientific approach, the Trump support is broad in age, if not in race.

    There might not be enough angry old white people, there might be enough concerned white people. I'm not sure this will be a traditional election that follows all the old rules.
    I'm sure that if the GOP can't pull something close to 40% of the Hispanic vote it is going down....unless there is a truly spectacular implosion on the other side.

    Trump is doing such a good job for the Dems that you could make an argument that he is trying to win the election for them (the argument would be wrong, but defensible). The Dems couldn't construct a 'get out the vote' campaign for Hispanic voters a fraction as powerful as having a guy who makes nasty comments about them & has a Spanish speaking news anchor dragged out of one of his press conferences lead polls of GOP voters. That moron snarling 'get out of my country' is a poster boy for every white nativist.

    Meanwhile the candidates who are actually running for President can't get arrested & can't get out any other message. If Trump wasn't already so rich Hilary would probably offer to pay him to stay in the race all the way to the convention. If he & others like him get a spot on the podium at the convention you won't be able to hear the crowd baying over the sound of the GOP bleeding votes.

    Leave a comment:


  • Wooden Wonder
    replied
    Originally posted by Gixxer86g View Post
    Marmat, I will give you and Marc credit for naming a new hairstyle. The Flying F***.

    Yeh, but you wouldn't need to shell out taxes on Airforce One, 'cos he already has his own fleet of them.

    Leave a comment:


  • Escape2Victory
    replied
    Originally posted by ChrisF1987 View Post
    Short version: Despite what Ann Coulter might think we simply do not have enough angry old White people to win national elections anymore. Period. Sorry Ann, but that's a fact.
    Going on the media images, admittedly not an especially scientific approach, the Trump support is broad in age, if not in race.

    There might not be enough angry old white people, there might be enough concerned white people. I'm not sure this will be a traditional election that follows all the old rules.

    Leave a comment:


  • Mountain Man
    replied
    Originally posted by Marmat View Post
    ... I'd like to thank you and the "Do" Academy on behalf of myself and Marc, who's away on location. The "Flying F***" really seems to be catching on!


    Leave a comment:


  • Mountain Man
    replied
    I wonder how many of those disgruntled Hispanics are citizens and legally registered to vote? I'll bet those are ones who like Trump.

    Leave a comment:


  • ChrisF1987
    replied
    Originally posted by Daemon of Decay View Post
    Worse, there are plenty of those on the right who believe the GOP's problems are because it hasn't been conservative enough and that just following Reagan's playbook will guarantee victory - ignoring as they do that the GOP has painted itself with a number of issues that don't gel well with many large American demographics.

    Look at the GOP and its approach to illegal immigration. Despite what people claim time and again that they're not targeting Hispanics and that it has nothing to do with ethnicity or race, the last few elections show that Hispanic Americans just aren't buying it.

    You would think the GOP would be all over a fast growing, religious, and socially conservative voting block, yet they continue to shoot themselves in the foot by talking about walls and dispatching the National Guard and mass deportations.

    And while this election has (thankfully) had a lesser barrage of social conservative messages than previous elections, the GOP still doesn't understand that they're losing that war. Gay marriage, pot legalization, and other social issues continue to have growing support amongst the general population - and especially amongst the next generation.

    The GOP is reaching the end of when business as usual can still work. If it wants to win, its going to have to start convincing Hispanics and others that it does actually represent them.

    That means they'll have to compromise on their beliefs - and with the all or nothing mentality we've seen, that's anathema to many conservatives.

    Although there are some who believe that a conservative rebound in the popular mind is just around the corner...
    Excellent post

    The argument that they only oppose illegal immigration doesent fly when the same people demand "English Only" laws and insinuate that only White people can be "real Americans". There's a perception - rightly or wrongly - that we hate anyone who is not an old White person living in solid red states like Mississippi or Kansas. We're seen as being backwards on just about every issue. And Lordy, the social conservatism in particular is a real killer.

    At some point we're going to have to either compromise or become relegated to the status of a regional party in the Deep South and the Midwest. We're going to have to develop a concept of 21st century conservatism that accepts the fact that the US is becoming an increasingly diverse, multicultural, multilingual nation and that things like gay marriage, abortion, etc are here to stay regardless of whether we conservatives like it or not. It's not the 1950s anymore. We need to modernize and adapt to changing realities of our time. Either the party evolves ... or it will die. It's as simple as that. We need to become a party that can compete everywhere from the smallest of small towns to the biggest of big cities and attract support from all racial groups.

    Short version: Despite what Ann Coulter might think we simply do not have enough angry old White people to win national elections anymore. Period. Sorry Ann, but that's a fact.

    Leave a comment:


  • Marmat
    replied
    Gix, ...

    Originally posted by Gixxer86g View Post
    Marmat, I will give you and Marc credit for naming a new hairstyle. The Flying F***.
    ... I'd like to thank you and the "Do" Academy on behalf of myself and Marc, who's away on location. The "Flying F***" really seems to be catching on!



    Amoungst Hispanic voters? Not so much.

    Leave a comment:


  • Daemon of Decay
    replied
    Originally posted by Jonathanrex1 View Post
    Well according to a few right-wing pundits like Ann Coulter, the GOP should not even try to appeal to non-whites and only focus on whites.
    Worse, there are plenty of those on the right who believe the GOP's problems are because it hasn't been conservative enough and that just following Reagan's playbook will guarantee victory - ignoring as they do that the GOP has painted itself with a number of issues that don't gel well with many large American demographics.

    Look at the GOP and its approach to illegal immigration. Despite what people claim time and again that they're not targeting Hispanics and that it has nothing to do with ethnicity or race, the last few elections show that Hispanic Americans just aren't buying it.

    You would think the GOP would be all over a fast growing, religious, and socially conservative voting block, yet they continue to shoot themselves in the foot by talking about walls and dispatching the National Guard and mass deportations.

    And while this election has (thankfully) had a lesser barrage of social conservative messages than previous elections, the GOP still doesn't understand that they're losing that war. Gay marriage, pot legalization, and other social issues continue to have growing support amongst the general population - and especially amongst the next generation.

    The GOP is reaching the end of when business as usual can still work. If it wants to win, its going to have to start convincing Hispanics and others that it does actually represent them.

    That means they'll have to compromise on their beliefs - and with the all or nothing mentality we've seen, that's anathema to many conservatives.

    Although there are some who believe that a conservative rebound in the popular mind is just around the corner...

    Leave a comment:


  • Jonathanrex1
    replied
    Originally posted by ChrisF1987 View Post
    Mitt Romney won an even greater share of the White vote than Ronald Reagan did in 1980 ... and Romney was still creamed. What does that tell you?
    Well according to a few right-wing pundits like Ann Coulter, the GOP should not even try to appeal to non-whites and only focus on whites.

    "The way Republicans win is by driving up the white vote," she told the Fox News host. "It is not by appealing to women or Hispanics or blacks. In fact, those groups are going to start fighting among one another ... How about, for once, appealing to your base? The Democrats obsess on 'How do we get gun rights voters to support us a tiny bit more? How do we get pro-lifers to support us? Let's get a slice of the evangelicals.'"
    It's the same, old song from Coulter who told O'Reilly on his show in October that the GOP needs to stop "sucking up" to Latinos because they will never be conservative voters.
    Besides being slightly racist by assuming Conservatism is tied to skin colour, Ann Coulter's idea is dead wrong. As you said Romney won 59% of the Non-Hispanic White Vote. The reaming 41% of Whites were likely made up of groups that have good reason not to vote for the GOP as it currently stands.

    Let's list them and the reasons why they don't vote Republican.

    • Atheists and Agnostics
    (Social Conservatives can never stop taking about God)

    • Feminists
    (Republicans love to attack Planned Parenthood)

    • Civil Rights Activists and SJWs
    (Republicans are largely against groups like BLM)

    • Union Members
    (Right-to-Work laws anyone?)

    • Pot Smokers
    (The War on Drugs anyone?)

    • College Educated Urban Residents
    (Republicans never make fun of 'elites' or the 'left coast')

    • Whites whose social circles includes Hispanics
    (Donald Trump)

    • LGBT People
    (Does this need explaining?)

    • Pacifists and Isolationists
    (Let's bomb Syria, Iran and ISIS!)

    • Occupy Wallstreet and Bernie Sander Supporters
    (Commie Scum!!!)

    Ann Coulter is so blinded by race that she somehow thinks these people will be more likely to vote for Republicans than some Hispanic Catholic, Pro-Life, small-buisness owner. Simply because they are white.
    Last edited by Jonathanrex1; 26 Aug 15, 10:08.

    Leave a comment:


  • ChrisF1987
    replied
    Call me a RINO, I don't care ... the fact is no Republican will ever sit behind the Resolute desk again unless he or she can win a minimum of 40% of the Hispanic vote. The only other alternative is to somehow win over 70% of the White vote ... a statistical impossibility. We (the GOP) have basically maxed out the White vote for all it's worth.

    Mitt Romney won an even greater share of the White vote than Ronald Reagan did in 1980 ... and Romney was still creamed. What does that tell you?

    Leave a comment:

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