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Should the Confederate flag be removed from SC statehouse grounds?

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  • Originally posted by slick_miester View Post
    The United States banned the importation of slaves from abroad by the enactment of the Slave Trade Act of 1808. It was part of the series of deals struck to ensure ratification of the Constitution. So slave ships would have only flown Old Glory for thirty-two years, or nineteen years under the Constitution.
    The importation of slaves was banned by the Constitution and was ratified by the Several States. The Slave Trade Act of 1808 is the enabling legislation.
    Don't leave good whiskey for the damn Yankees!" John Hunt Morgan, Eagleport, Ohio, July 23, 1863

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    • This is IMO taking things a bit far (and is possibly a suitable topic for the gaming board here?)......

      Apple is pulling Civil War gaming apps that include the Confederate battle flag.
      http://time.com/3936223/apple-civil-...mes-app-store/

      Comment


      • Originally posted by Daemon of Decay View Post
        You're right, it's wrong to allow businesses to choose what items they sell. The government should step in and force them to sell confederacy related items!
        Actually, there are some fringe sites and others I'm not familiar with that say the government ordered Amazon not to sell Confederate flags. Don't know if it's true.

        Infringement on free speech?
        {}

        "Any story sounds true until someone tells the other side and sets the record straight." -Proverbs 18:17

        Comment


        • Originally posted by BorderRuffian View Post
          Actually, there are some fringe sites and others I'm not familiar with that say the government ordered Amazon not to sell Confederate flags. Don't know if it's true.

          Infringement on free speech?
          And you believe that?

          Comment


          • Originally posted by guthrieba View Post
            But, then,why the rush (and vehemence) now?

            Remove the Flag from the State House Grounds - sure, should've been done years ago.

            But the situation has moved far beyond that in the past few days.
            Few events advanced the cause of desegregation as the murder of Emmett Till, and the subsequent interview with the acquitted murderers Roy Bryant and JW Milan. As if it wasn't bad enough that they beat a fourteen year old boy so badly that his eyeball fell out of its socket before they finally killed him, but that had the cast-iron audacity to brag about it after their acquittal. That shamed people, and not just in the North. William Faulkner wrote eloquently how their brand of evil stained the entire South.

            I guess in a similar vein, Dylann Roof's dastardly crime has focused a light on some of the South's still unresolved racial issues. Was Roof just plain nuts, or was he influenced by this unrepentant Lost Cause culture, or perhaps something else altogether, or maybe all of the above? Continuing to fly that flag on the statehouse grounds certainly makes it fair game within the political arena.

            And if, as you say, cessation of flying the CSA flag "should've been done years ago," then why not do it now?

            Originally posted by guthrieba View Post
            Eurasia has always been at war with Oceania.
            That bit of irony is apropos of the Lost Cause movement, to be sure.

            Originally posted by guthrieba View Post
            The importation of slaves was banned by the Constitution and was ratified by the Several States. The Slave Trade Act of 1808 is the enabling legislation.
            Indeed -- but the trade continued until 1808. The act officially put an end to it.
            I was married for two ******* years! Hell would be like Club Med! - Sam Kinison

            Comment


            • Originally posted by slick_miester View Post
              Few events advanced the cause of desegregation as the murder of Emmett Till, and the subsequent interview with the acquitted murderers Roy Bryant and JW Milan. As if it wasn't bad enough that they beat a fourteen year old boy so badly that his eyeball fell out of its socket before they finally killed him, but that had the cast-iron audacity to brag about it after their acquittal. That shamed people, and not just in the North. William Faulkner wrote eloquently how their brand of evil stained the entire South.

              I guess in a similar vein, Dylann Roof's dastardly crime has focused a light on some of the South's still unresolved racial issues. Was Roof just plain nuts, or was he influenced by this unrepentant Lost Cause culture, or perhaps something else altogether, or maybe all of the above? Continuing to fly that flag on the statehouse grounds certainly makes it fair game within the political arena.

              And if, as you say, cessation of flying the CSA flag "should've been done years ago," then why not do it now?



              That bit of irony is apropos of the Lost Cause movement, to be sure.



              Indeed -- but the trade continued until 1808. The act officially put an end to it.
              The Act made it illegal. But the slave trade continued to a limited extent up until the 1850s. There was no genuine commitment to end the slave trade until after the Civil War.
              "To be free is better than to be unfree - always."

              Comment


              • Originally posted by Surrey View Post
                The Act made it illegal. But the slave trade continued to a limited extent up until the 1850s. There was no genuine commitment to end the slave trade until after the Civil War.
                That trade was illegal, a violation of Federal law. That's why slaves in the antebellum South were so expensive: they could not be readily replaced.

                in 1860 there were nearly four million slaves [in the US] and their average market value was around $800, but what does that mean? How much would that be in today's dollars?

                "Measuring Slavery in 2011 Dollars," by Samuel H. Williamson and Louis P. Cain, Neasuring Worth-dot-com
                - emphasis mine

                Pumping that figure into an "inflation calculator" yields a present-day value of $22,157.82. Few people today plunk down $22,157.82 (or £14,072.48 for you) in cash. They usually borrow. The same was even truer in the antebellum South, which, as an overwhelmingly agrarian economy in an earlier era was extremely cash-poor. Had it been legal to import slaves into the US, I'm sure that their value would have been a lot less, probably a lot closer to an Indian Untouchable's, perhaps.
                I was married for two ******* years! Hell would be like Club Med! - Sam Kinison

                Comment


                • Originally posted by Combat Engineer View Post
                  Yes, we know. Thanks for the immaterial info.

                  The fact that you can't think through the differences is amazing, or are just pretending you can't which is strange.
                  More amazing that no one is offended by the Confederate flag any more than a fairytale, a Snapple label, or the n-word.
                  My worst jump story:
                  My 13th jump was on the 13th day of the month, aircraft number 013.
                  As recorded on my DA Form 1307 Individual Jump Log.
                  No lie.

                  ~
                  "Everything looks all right. Have a good jump, eh."
                  -2 Commando Jumpmaster

                  Comment


                  • Originally posted by 101combatvet View Post
                    More amazing that no one is offended by the Confederate flag any more than a fairytale, a Snapple label, or the n-word.
                    So by your rationale, Kerry should have won the presidency.



                    Still can't figure out why he lost, can you?
                    I was married for two ******* years! Hell would be like Club Med! - Sam Kinison

                    Comment


                    • Originally posted by slick_miester View Post
                      So by your rationale, Kerry should have won the presidency.



                      Still can't figure out why he lost, can you?
                      So how many blacks were offended by Kerry?
                      My worst jump story:
                      My 13th jump was on the 13th day of the month, aircraft number 013.
                      As recorded on my DA Form 1307 Individual Jump Log.
                      No lie.

                      ~
                      "Everything looks all right. Have a good jump, eh."
                      -2 Commando Jumpmaster

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by 101combatvet View Post
                        More amazing that no one is offended by the Confederate flag any more than a fairytale, a Snapple label, or the n-word.
                        Offensiveness is dependent upon many, many factors. Nobody is claiming that the confederate flag should be removed from history, deleted from text books, or otherwise banned from private hands.

                        What is offensive is that a symbol of racism and oppression to many American's is placed out in front of a government building on public property.

                        Hearing the n-word in a rap song is far different than if the n-word was carved into the capitol building by the local government, wouldn't you agree?

                        Comment


                        • ...unforeseen consequences

                          Flag sales

                          Rebel Store:

                          "Sorry – we have sold out.

                          Thank you so much – our faith in the South has been renewed! If you have already placed an order with us – please be patient and rest assured that we are working as quickly as possible to get your order out to you and we will send an email as soon as we ship with the tracking information. We have received over 3,000 orders in less than 24 hours, when a good day for us is 20 orders in 24 hours. We are filling them and shipping in the order in which they were received.

                          As soon as we are ‘caught up’ with the backlog, we will again have the website back up and running."

                          Southern Pride Flag Company:

                          "Due to unusually high volume we cannot accept e-mails or phone calls at the present time. All previously received emails and phone messages will be responded to ASAP. All will be restored soon, please be patient.
                          Thank You and God Save the South."

                          Proud Rebel Store:

                          "Sorry folks!

                          Rebel flags are completely sold out, everywhere!
                          Nothing like this since 9-11!"
                          {}

                          "Any story sounds true until someone tells the other side and sets the record straight." -Proverbs 18:17

                          Comment


                          • Originally posted by BorderRuffian View Post
                            ...unforeseen consequences

                            Flag sales

                            Rebel Store:

                            "Sorry – we have sold out.

                            Thank you so much – our faith in the South has been renewed! If you have already placed an order with us – please be patient and rest assured that we are working as quickly as possible to get your order out to you and we will send an email as soon as we ship with the tracking information. We have received over 3,000 orders in less than 24 hours, when a good day for us is 20 orders in 24 hours. We are filling them and shipping in the order in which they were received.

                            As soon as we are ‘caught up’ with the backlog, we will again have the website back up and running."

                            Southern Pride Flag Company:

                            "Due to unusually high volume we cannot accept e-mails or phone calls at the present time. All previously received emails and phone messages will be responded to ASAP. All will be restored soon, please be patient.
                            Thank You and God Save the South."

                            Proud Rebel Store:

                            "Sorry folks!

                            Rebel flags are completely sold out, everywhere!
                            Nothing like this since 9-11!"
                            Not really unforeseen at all. This thread alone is proof positive that passions run high when talking about a piece of cloth.

                            Comment


                            • Originally posted by Daemon of Decay View Post
                              Not really unforeseen at all, really. This thread alone is proof positive that passions run high when talking about a piece of cloth.
                              20 to 3000 - what percentage increase is that?
                              Something like fourteen thou...
                              {}

                              "Any story sounds true until someone tells the other side and sets the record straight." -Proverbs 18:17

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by BorderRuffian View Post
                                20 to 3000 - what percentage increase is that?
                                Something like fourteen thou...
                                Anytime people feel something they love is threatened, sales soar.

                                Remember New Coke?

                                How about flag sales post 9/11?

                                Flag makers love this sort of thing.

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