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  • DeltaOne
    replied
    I think HP touched on something a couple pages back. Growing up in the 50's and early 60's, the gun 'culture' in our country was far different than it is today. From the time our kids are toddlers up through their teens, how many games, shows, movies and songs have exposed them to guns as being cool and gun violence as an acceptable means of settling disputes? Lets face it, our modern media sends a message that a gun is a justifiable means of dealing with other people. I genuinely think that these media sources have created a monster that is now running out of control in some neighborhoods in every city across the US. When I was teen, we would scrap out in the schoolyard with someone we had a beef with. Today, that dispute has a big chance of being settled with gunfire.

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  • DeltaOne
    replied
    Originally posted by Mountain Man View Post
    Yes, I did, because the consequences of not doing so were severe, and my father was a soldier, so weapons were a part of my life.

    My daughters grew up with the knowledge that ignoring instructions from their father was counter to their survival. Understanding "why" or "why not" comes AFTER doing as told, period.

    I wasn't raised like the modern good-for-nothing, self-indugent Spock generation to allow sounds in through one ear and out through other, less suitable bodily orifices.
    How the hell do you even know what you did at 2.5 or 3 years old? So you were perfect because your dad was a soldier and you would get punished? So was mine and I had the fear of god of displeasing him but if I tried to float the turd you are here, I would expect someone to call me on it and tell me I was full of ****! I was far from perfect. Besides, like I said before, we are forever curious at that age and the times we aren't willfully doing wrong, we are lured into it by curiosity.
    The onus is on the adult, not the child! Any nonsense that tries to reverse that and justify a stupid adult leaving a loaded gun unattended with a child is the biggest load of crap on this site! My kids got the strap. The knew they were in a world of hurt if they got caught doing something wrong that was serious. Did it make them angels? Hell no! It made them far more devious if anything. When they did something, they went for broke cause they knew they were going to pay the price for it either way - so they would jump in with both feet. I believe parents have now gone so far the other way that kids have no sense of right from wrong and our society is paying the price now. Firm discipline is needed but common sense on the part of a parent is also needed and both of those things are woefully absent today!

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  • Urban hermit
    replied
    Originally posted by SRV Ron View Post
    It was Dr Spock's books on the Progressive methods of child rearing, replacing discipline with understanding the undesirable behavior, that has resulted in the explosion of feral kids and manipulative brats that are becoming all too common in today's society.http://www.ask.com/wiki/Benjamin_Spock
    Spock's son turn out a total wreck.

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  • SRV Ron
    replied
    Originally posted by holly6 View Post
    MM, many are going to hammer you for such ancient drivel. I can really understand why it's so hard for posters to understand what you say.
    1. The guns were present. All year long, but particularly in the Fall. Blue steel and hardwood, (thx hpj)
    2. I was the youngest. From the time of my understanding, the rules had already been set. What people don't understand is that this was not a brutal system. Actually, it was quite simplistic. Rule, consequence, the same concept was used in many minor situations, we never wanted to try a major one.
    It was Dr Spock's books on the Progressive methods of child rearing, replacing discipline with understanding the undesirable behavior, that has resulted in the explosion of feral kids and manipulative brats that are becoming all too common in today's society.http://www.ask.com/wiki/Benjamin_Spock

    Leave a comment:


  • holly6
    replied
    Originally posted by Mountain Man View Post
    Yes, I did, because the consequences of not doing so were severe, and my father was a soldier, so weapons were a part of my life.

    My daughters grew up with the knowledge that ignoring instructions from their father was counter to their survival. Understanding "why" or "why not" comes AFTER doing as told, period.

    I wasn't raised like the modern good-for-nothing, self-indugent Spock generation to allow sounds in through one ear and out through other, less suitable bodily orifices.
    MM, many are going to hammer you for such ancient drivel. I can really understand why it's so hard for posters to understand what you say.
    1. The guns were present. All year long, but particularly in the Fall. Blue steel and hardwood, (thx hpj)
    2. I was the youngest. From the time of my understanding, the rules had already been set. What people don't understand is that this was not a brutal system. Actually, it was quite simplistic. Rule, consequence, the same concept was used in many minor situations, we never wanted to try a major one.

    Leave a comment:


  • Mountain Man
    replied
    Originally posted by DeltaOne View Post
    Did you listen to everything your parents told you at 3, 4, or 5 years of age?
    Yes, I did, because the consequences of not doing so were severe, and my father was a soldier, so weapons were a part of my life.

    My daughters grew up with the knowledge that ignoring instructions from their father was counter to their survival. Understanding "why" or "why not" comes AFTER doing as told, period.

    I wasn't raised like the modern good-for-nothing, self-indugent Spock generation to allow sounds in through one ear and out through other, less suitable bodily orifices.

    Leave a comment:


  • Urban hermit
    replied
    Follow up on this story

    This is the out come of the case.
    The court has decided the value of a 5 year old child's life is $28,000.00
    The penalty for not securing weapons in the presence of a child is to attend a safety class, and get counseling.
    I do not know if the victims patents can still seek a civil case.

    POCATELLO, Idaho (AP) - A Chubbuck couple has had their charges in the accidental shooting death of a 5-year-old conditionally dismissed.


    KIDK-TV reports in papers filed Wednesday, Rusty and Ashlee Lish were able to reach a deferred prosecution agreement with prosecutors.


    The terms of the deal include completion of parenting and gun safety courses, family counseling, a $28,000 payment to the child's family, among other conditions.


    The couple had pleaded guilty to charges of misdemeanor injury to a child in connection with the death of Noelle Shawver.


    Noelle was shot by the Lishes' 5-year-old in July while visiting the couple's home. Prosecutors allege the couple left loaded firearms within reach of the children.


    A county prosecutor says charges against the couple could be brought back if any of the deal's terms are broken.
    http://www.ktvb.com/story/news/crime...rges/27772207/

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  • Bwaha
    replied
    Originally posted by Urban hermit View Post
    No, I was not a perfect child, my dad was a cop and had weapons in the home, he made sure they were secured and properly so.
    I did the same with mine, children are irresponsible, that is why adult have to be diligent, the parents in the OP were negligent.
    His macho man image was more important to him than his role as a father providing a safe environment for his children and his guest.
    I totally agree.

    My uncle was a example of the bad gun owner. Guns strewn all over the place, on the coffee table, ect...

    I remember my Dad chewing him out when I was a kid and dragging us kids to safety.

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  • Urban hermit
    replied
    Originally posted by Bwaha View Post
    Anyone who's had a child has told the child 'Dont touch the stove, It'll burn you...'

    Just to hear the wails of the child shortly later.

    How about 'Stay out of the road'. Promptly issuing a spanking later, as said child tries to check out the admonition...



    I guess some of you have perfect children who don't rebel and behave like angels...

    Mine wasn't and neither was I...
    No, I was not a perfect child, my dad was a cop and had weapons in the home, he made sure they were secured and properly so.
    I did the same with mine, children are irresponsible, that is why adult have to be diligent, the parents in the OP were negligent.
    His macho man image was more important to him than his role as a father providing a safe environment for his children and his guest.

    Leave a comment:


  • Bwaha
    replied
    Anyone who's had a child has told the child 'Dont touch the stove, It'll burn you...'

    Just to hear the wails of the child shortly later.

    How about 'Stay out of the road'. Promptly issuing a spanking later, as said child tries to check out the admonition...



    I guess some of you have perfect children who don't rebel and behave like angels...

    Mine wasn't and neither was I...

    Leave a comment:


  • SRV Ron
    replied
    Then, there are kids that run Feral thanks to their parents.
    http://www.wnem.com/story/28964224/k...-stash-of-guns

    In this case, they broke into an unoccupied home and stole guns and ammunition. Thankfully, they didn't shoot anybody while playing with them.

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  • DeltaOne
    replied
    Originally posted by Mountain Man View Post
    Both negate the purpose of keeping a weapon for home defense.

    How about teaching kids what guns are for and how to properly handle them at all times?
    Did you listen to everything your parents told you at 3, 4, or 5 years of age? Your argument is flawed if you think telling a child not to touch something will be the answer to this problem. Kids are naturally curious. Its why this crap happens so often. The onus is not on a five year old here, its on the stupid adult parents who don't practice gun safety! Its nice to just call stuff like this accidents because that softens the whole thing.
    I've have personally witnessed hundreds of children be poisoned by prescription medication and every one of those parents would say, 'I told him/her never to touch my medication or they would get very sick'! Well, it didn't work for them and it same goes for those who try this weak argument for gun safety; 'I told Johnie to never touch the gun without me'! You can't expect small children to reason on the dangers and think they are safe automatically. When you raised your kids, did you tell them why they need to always wear a seat belt when in the car and then never check that they had it on? No. Responsible adults don't leave small children on their own to make safe decisions. Why? Because they can't foresee or comprehend what the outcomes of such will be at such a young age.
    Its time for people to wake up and stop making excuses for irresponsible parents where guns are involved due to a fear that new laws or regulations will come about and change how things are done with this all. Safety regulations NEED to happen and they HAVE to evolve as incidents happen to make everyone safer. PERIOD!

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  • Urban hermit
    replied
    Originally posted by Nichols View Post
    No, robbery is not common sense........at least not where I am from.
    You missed my point, the robber tossed a gun in the bushes next to a child's house, the child had the common sense to tell an adult.
    In the OP the adult didn't have the common sense to protect his own child's life, or that of an other parent.

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  • Nichols
    replied
    Originally posted by Urban hermit View Post
    The same could be said about the robbery, huh?
    No, robbery is not common sense........at least not where I am from.

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  • Urban hermit
    replied
    Originally posted by Nichols View Post
    Regarding the OP case, it isn't a matter of training.

    It is a lack of common sense.
    The same could be said about the robbery, huh?

    Leave a comment:

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