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73 year old LEO mistakes pistol for a taser. You know the rest of the story.

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  • #31
    Originally posted by Andy H View Post
    Hi

    So whats this officer likely to be charged with-Involuntary Manslaughter?

    Regards

    Andy H
    Nothing, likely. The video establishes human error. Last I checked they weren't looking at criminal charges.

    The agency will likely get sued, based on NJ case law.
    Any man can hold his place when the bands play and women throw flowers; it is when the enemy presses close and metal shears through the ranks that one can acertain which are soldiers, and which are not.

    Comment


    • #32
      Originally posted by Arnold J Rimmer View Post
      Nothing, likely. The video establishes human error. Last I checked they weren't looking at criminal charges.

      The agency will likely get sued, based on NJ case law.
      Hi AJR

      Thanks for the reply.
      Could the victims family take out a civil criminal case against the officer?

      Regards

      Andy H
      "You have enemies? Good. That means you've stood up for something, sometime in your life." Churchill

      "I'm no reactionary.Christ on the Mountain! I'm as idealistic as Hell" Eisenhower

      Comment


      • #33
        Originally posted by Andy H View Post
        Hi AJR

        Thanks for the reply.
        Could the victims family take out a civil criminal case against the officer?

        Regards

        Andy H
        There is no such thing here. There is civil law, and there is criminal law. If you mean could they press charges the answer is no, the State presses charges on behalf of the dead.

        If you mean a civil suit, then maybe. They can sue the agency, but the police, like all officers of the court, are partially shielded from suits, and in addition all US citizens are shielded from much of civil suits.

        Their only real option is to sue the agency for failure to train. Given that the officer followed the verbal procedure for using a TASER, and actually dropped his weapon when he felt the recoil, will make it interesting.

        I imagine they'll get a small settlement.
        Any man can hold his place when the bands play and women throw flowers; it is when the enemy presses close and metal shears through the ranks that one can acertain which are soldiers, and which are not.

        Comment


        • #34
          Originally posted by Arnold J Rimmer View Post
          There is no such thing here. There is civil law, and there is criminal law. If you mean could they press charges the answer is no, the State presses charges on behalf of the dead.

          If you mean a civil suit, then maybe. They can sue the agency, but the police, like all officers of the court, are partially shielded from suits, and in addition all US citizens are shielded from much of civil suits.

          Their only real option is to sue the agency for failure to train. Given that the officer followed the verbal procedure for using a TASER, and actually dropped his weapon when he felt the recoil, will make it interesting.

          I imagine they'll get a small settlement.
          Hi AJR

          Thanks.

          Regards

          Andy H
          "You have enemies? Good. That means you've stood up for something, sometime in your life." Churchill

          "I'm no reactionary.Christ on the Mountain! I'm as idealistic as Hell" Eisenhower

          Comment


          • #35
            Hi

            An interesting piece on a number of fronts:-

            http://www.policeone.com/police-trai...apture-errors/

            Regards

            Andy H
            "You have enemies? Good. That means you've stood up for something, sometime in your life." Churchill

            "I'm no reactionary.Christ on the Mountain! I'm as idealistic as Hell" Eisenhower

            Comment


            • #36
              Back before I quit carrying a TASER I wore in on my left hip for left-hand draw.

              This would prevent that situation, and gave me the option of deploying a TASER while my weapon was drawn, or a fast transition to lethal force if a situation went radically wrong.

              However, that's an option only to those who are comfortable with left-handed use.

              One unexpected benefit of this was that a subject attempted to disarm me, and came in on my left side. Its amazing how many people thought I was wearing two sidearms.
              Any man can hold his place when the bands play and women throw flowers; it is when the enemy presses close and metal shears through the ranks that one can acertain which are soldiers, and which are not.

              Comment


              • #37
                I don't like to do the whole Monday morning quarterback thing but I really don't think 73 year olds should be serving as reserve officers on patrol duties.

                Here in New York our county sheriff's departments abolished reserve deputy programs in 2001 due to concerns that sheriffs were using the program as a way to reward political favors. Many municipal police departments (including the NYPD) have auxiliary police programs but they do not carry guns, and they cannot handle actual police work ... in other words they just direct traffic and escort parades and such. Some towns & villages here on Long Island do have seasonal officers for the summer months, however they are fully trained and must meet the state certification requirements.

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                • #38
                  Originally posted by ChrisF1987 View Post
                  I don't like to do the whole Monday morning quarterback thing but I really don't think 73 year olds should be serving as reserve officers on patrol duties.

                  Here in New York our county sheriff's departments abolished reserve deputy programs in 2001 due to concerns that sheriffs were using the program as a way to reward political favors. Many municipal police departments (including the NYPD) have auxiliary police programs but they do not carry guns, and they cannot handle actual police work ... in other words they just direct traffic and escort parades and such. Some towns & villages here on Long Island do have seasonal officers for the summer months, however they are fully trained and must meet the state certification requirements.
                  I have steep reservations about the age aspect, too.

                  In Texas a reserve officer has to have the same academy training as a full-time officer, and has to meet the same continuing education standards. Many agencies, like mine, do not allow them on their own, but rather as a second officer in a patrol unit.

                  Ours have been a tremendous help. They have to work a minimum of 24 hours each month to remain in the program, and serve as a very welcome manpower multiplier, especially since several are retired from other agencies and bring a body of training and experience that is extremely valuable.

                  Like many things, its all how you handle the situation.
                  Any man can hold his place when the bands play and women throw flowers; it is when the enemy presses close and metal shears through the ranks that one can acertain which are soldiers, and which are not.

                  Comment


                  • #39
                    Originally posted by Arnold J Rimmer View Post
                    Well, he was a former full-time officer...
                    For one year, back before you were born...

                    Comment


                    • #40
                      Originally posted by johns624 View Post
                      For one year, back before you were born...
                      Yeah, true.
                      Any man can hold his place when the bands play and women throw flowers; it is when the enemy presses close and metal shears through the ranks that one can acertain which are soldiers, and which are not.

                      Comment


                      • #41
                        Originally posted by Arnold J Rimmer View Post
                        Maybe in Scotland.

                        But then, Scots are much more docile.
                        Not really, but we seldom carry firearms.

                        Anyone stupid enough to attack a police officer, with a blade or an improvised weapon, learns a hard lesson very quickly. The men are even worse.

                        Our firearms laws mean that our police rarely encounter them, and they can deal with just about anything else - generally without breaking sweat.
                        Indyref2 - still, "Yes."

                        Comment


                        • #42
                          Originally posted by the ace View Post
                          Not really, but we seldom carry firearms.

                          Anyone stupid enough to attack a police officer, with a blade or an improvised weapon, learns a hard lesson very quickly. The men are even worse.

                          Our firearms laws mean that our police rarely encounter them, and they can deal with just about anything else - generally without breaking sweat.
                          Like I said: Docile.

                          If we wanted your system, we would have kept it.
                          Any man can hold his place when the bands play and women throw flowers; it is when the enemy presses close and metal shears through the ranks that one can acertain which are soldiers, and which are not.

                          Comment


                          • #43
                            Originally posted by Arnold J Rimmer View Post
                            Like I said: Docile.

                            If we wanted your system, we would have kept it.
                            Apart from anything else, most Scottish officers can catch a suspect who tries to run away.

                            Only an idiot picks a fight with someone who can fold him in four and post him through the letterbox - like everyone else, we have our share of idiots, but not many officers injured in the line of duty.
                            Indyref2 - still, "Yes."

                            Comment


                            • #44
                              Originally posted by the ace View Post
                              Apart from anything else, most Scottish officers can catch a suspect who tries to run away.

                              Only an idiot picks a fight with someone who can fold him in four and post him through the letterbox - like everyone else, we have our share of idiots, but not many officers injured in the line of duty.
                              Because you're docile.

                              London tells you that can't own firearms, and you tug your forelock and submit.

                              Tell an American he can't do something, and odds are he'll tell you to off and do it anyway.
                              Any man can hold his place when the bands play and women throw flowers; it is when the enemy presses close and metal shears through the ranks that one can acertain which are soldiers, and which are not.

                              Comment


                              • #45
                                Originally posted by Arnold J Rimmer View Post

                                Tell an American he can't do something, and odds are he'll tell you to off and do it anyway.
                                Then get 6 rounds in the back from a cop.

                                Matthew 5:9 Blessed are the cheesemakers

                                That's right bitches. I'm blessed!

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