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  • T. A. Gardner
    replied
    Originally posted by Snowshoveler View Post
    Someone letting out the motivations behind the green agenda it’s all about the power that they can force on people being frightened to death by their propaganda

    E7B0F5DC-E3E7-493A-A64B-82BFE761F5F7.jpeg

    Leave a comment:


  • Snowshoveler
    replied
    CA848A42-138C-4475-955C-40772BB3F850.jpeg More details

    Leave a comment:


  • Snowshoveler
    replied
    Someone letting out the motivations behind the green agenda it’s all about the power that they can force on people being frightened to death by their propaganda

    E7B0F5DC-E3E7-493A-A64B-82BFE761F5F7.jpeg

    Leave a comment:


  • Jutland
    replied
    Originally posted by T. A. Gardner View Post
    Seems the Nazis were fans of wind farms before they became fashionable...

    http://en.friends-against-wind.org/r...terally-hitler
    Well that totally invalidates wind farms........

    Leave a comment:


  • T. A. Gardner
    replied
    Seems the Nazis were fans of wind farms before they became fashionable...

    http://en.friends-against-wind.org/r...terally-hitler

    Leave a comment:


  • bill shack
    replied
    Originally posted by SRV Ron View Post

    Just how many people will willingly give up their lifestyle and freedom for a life of slavery in The Collective just for the sake of stopping Climate Change? True, there are many alternatives. Some are good, such as industry working to operate more efficiently and control pollution. Others worthless such as relying on solar power to charge the batteries of the electric cars when one considers how environmentally damaging it is to manufacture the batteries and solar panels, not to mention turning acres of cropland or meadows into solar farms. But, that's not what the Far Left Environmentalist want. They want drastic changes NOW. No cows, no aircraft, no power generation using coal, oil, gas, hydropower, or nuclear and the retrofitting of all inhabited structures to sustainable use according to Representative Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez, who is running for President. Therefore, according to them, a Scorched Earth or Communism is the only solution for curing Global Warming, Climate Change, whatever it is being called according to if it is getting warmer, or cooler.

    https://www.bloomberg.com/news/artic...green-new-deal
    How can we trust anything you say when you say and i quote Representative Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez, who is running for President.. she is not and has never been so
    Bennet
    Biden
    Bloomberg
    Booker
    Bullock
    Buttigieg
    Castro
    Delaney
    Gabbard
    Harris
    Klobuchar
    Patrick
    Sanders
    Sestak
    Steyer
    Warren
    Williamson
    Yang
    Trump
    Walsh

    Leave a comment:


  • Nick the Noodle
    replied
    Originally posted by T. A. Gardner View Post

    Actually, science has pretty much proved me right. You can't get around the watt-density of sunlight or planetary rotation. Sure, in space solar works way better, but that doesn't help us peons on the planet any. Solar is simply an idiotic solution to a problem that might not even need a solution.
    While Solar is not a solution in its own right, it's certainly a step in the right direction, and a reasonable source to 'top up' energy as required.
    Originally posted by T. A. Gardner View Post
    I try to. The problem is that the fashionable solutions are worse than the problem.
    We don't know that yet.

    What we do know is that we need to change our reliance on fossil fuel. Tesla's approach (scientist, not car company) is probably the correct solution.

    Leave a comment:


  • T. A. Gardner
    replied
    Originally posted by Nick the Noodle View Post
    Technology will prove you wrong .

    Nuclear is probably the best current solution imho. I agree with you here.

    However, Solar may take us to the stars.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Solar_sail
    Actually, science has pretty much proved me right. You can't get around the watt-density of sunlight or planetary rotation. Sure, in space solar works way better, but that doesn't help us peons on the planet any. Solar is simply an idiotic solution to a problem that might not even need a solution.

    Ignore the politics. Current fashionable solutions have not got us into this serious mess.

    The problem is Pollution, and not just gases. We use Oceans as both a major food source and our latrine as an example.
    I try to. The problem is that the fashionable solutions are worse than the problem.

    Leave a comment:


  • bill shack
    replied
    for all of those that think that climate change is not caused by humans . what if you are wrong and do nothing about it.GENEVA (Reuters) - Global temperatures are on course for a 3-5 degrees Celsius (5.4-9.0 degrees Fahrenheit) rise this century, far overshooting a global target of limiting the increase to 2C (3.6F) or less, the U.N. World Meteorological Organization said on Thursdayhttps://www.reuters.com/article/us-c...-idUSKCN1NY186
    https://www.unenvironment.org/resour...ap-report-2019

    Leave a comment:


  • Nick the Noodle
    replied
    Originally posted by T. A. Gardner View Post

    Actually, this is the pie in the sky environmental version. Solar energy and batteries will never be efficient. You can't get around the basic chemistry and physics of how they work. To generate one Kilowatt Day (KWD) of power from solar you need about 5 KW of installed solar panels. You can look at any solar generating plant and see this. They all have a capacity factor of 20 to 25%. Solana, the largest commercial solar plant in Arizona (at Gila Bend in the Sonoran Desert) is 26.6% rated, which is about the best you can do in a desert in the US. Ivanpah, the largest solar plant in the US (Mojave desert California) is 20.5% rated.
    The other thing engineers are finding out is that very large solar arrays disrupt local weather patterns. This contributes to climate change.

    https://weather.com/science/environm...e-change-study

    https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/...ange-a-little/

    Batteries, pumped hydro, flywheels, and other storage systems for solar are a costly add on that decreases the overall efficiency of the system and raises the cost per KWH. Battery storage is inefficient at best. You can never get more than about 2 VDC per cell out of a battery. The laws of chemistry and a look at a periodic table confirm that. Pumped hydro or flywheels consume power to make them work meaning you need more power to store power.
    Worse, you need about 4 KW of installed capacity to get to 1 KWD of power. Most plants that have such storage can only supply power for a few hours after the solar panels stop generating. So, you are left needing conventional generation means on top of the solar, making for redundant capacity that mostly sits unused and not making money but costing money.

    The weather thing is a big problem, and in a desert it along with other issues makes solar undesirable. Large arrays in a hot desert will form a column of hot, rising air above them. This pulls in air from the surrounding area creating a cyclonic wind effect and disrupts natural wind patterns. Both Solana and Ivanpah have this issue.
    Solar in general, even smaller numerous arrays in residential and commercial areas contribute to urban heat island effect and increase ozone pollution as a result.
    Also, solar plants require considerable water resources to clean the panels, etc. This depletes groundwater as the only source is usually from a well or wells set up to supply it to the array.

    Basically, solar is a pathetic loser of a way to make electricity. Even if the array were free, it's so inefficient that it costs more than generation by more conventional means.
    Technology will prove you wrong .
    Originally posted by T. A. Gardner View Post
    Nuclear is the best solution. The radioactive "waste" can be managed safely. Natural gas is the bridge from coal to nuclear as it is much cleaner to use. It also represents the best supplement to nuclear at the moment for peaking load plants. Solar is utterly stupid.
    Nuclear is probably the best current solution imho. I agree with you here.

    However, Solar may take us to the stars.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Solar_sail
    Originally posted by T. A. Gardner View Post
    That selfish stupidity is battery cars, solar and wind, and other "solutions" coming from idiots on the Progressive Left like Al Gore and the like.
    Ignore the politics. Current fashionable solutions have not got us into this serious mess.

    The problem is Pollution, and not just gases. We use Oceans as both a major food source and our latrine as an example.

    Leave a comment:


  • bill shack
    replied
    Actually batteries have change a lot please see
    https://www.cbc.ca/news/technology/d...tion-1.4945615
    things are changing very quickly , a lot of the old arguments no longer count .

    Leave a comment:


  • T. A. Gardner
    replied
    Originally posted by Nick the Noodle View Post

    Worthless at the moment, but the tech on solar energy and batteries will get there. Further, infertile deserts make excellent locations for solar power.
    Actually, this is the pie in the sky environmental version. Solar energy and batteries will never be efficient. You can't get around the basic chemistry and physics of how they work. To generate one Kilowatt Day (KWD) of power from solar you need about 5 KW of installed solar panels. You can look at any solar generating plant and see this. They all have a capacity factor of 20 to 25%. Solana, the largest commercial solar plant in Arizona (at Gila Bend in the Sonoran Desert) is 26.6% rated, which is about the best you can do in a desert in the US. Ivanpah, the largest solar plant in the US (Mojave desert California) is 20.5% rated.
    The other thing engineers are finding out is that very large solar arrays disrupt local weather patterns. This contributes to climate change.

    https://weather.com/science/environm...e-change-study

    https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/...ange-a-little/

    Batteries, pumped hydro, flywheels, and other storage systems for solar are a costly add on that decreases the overall efficiency of the system and raises the cost per KWH. Battery storage is inefficient at best. You can never get more than about 2 VDC per cell out of a battery. The laws of chemistry and a look at a periodic table confirm that. Pumped hydro or flywheels consume power to make them work meaning you need more power to store power.
    Worse, you need about 4 KW of installed capacity to get to 1 KWD of power. Most plants that have such storage can only supply power for a few hours after the solar panels stop generating. So, you are left needing conventional generation means on top of the solar, making for redundant capacity that mostly sits unused and not making money but costing money.

    The weather thing is a big problem, and in a desert it along with other issues makes solar undesirable. Large arrays in a hot desert will form a column of hot, rising air above them. This pulls in air from the surrounding area creating a cyclonic wind effect and disrupts natural wind patterns. Both Solana and Ivanpah have this issue.
    Solar in general, even smaller numerous arrays in residential and commercial areas contribute to urban heat island effect and increase ozone pollution as a result.
    Also, solar plants require considerable water resources to clean the panels, etc. This depletes groundwater as the only source is usually from a well or wells set up to supply it to the array.

    Basically, solar is a pathetic loser of a way to make electricity. Even if the array were free, it's so inefficient that it costs more than generation by more conventional means.


    I am a current fan of nuclear power, and believe we will eventually be able to harness the energy in the radioactive waste, so I am not a leftie Green.
    Nuclear is the best solution. The radioactive "waste" can be managed safely. Natural gas is the bridge from coal to nuclear as it is much cleaner to use. It also represents the best supplement to nuclear at the moment for peaking load plants. Solar is utterly stupid.

    We do need to do something quickly, but I now feel its probably too late, and our descendants will suffer from our selfish stupidity.
    That selfish stupidity is battery cars, solar and wind, and other "solutions" coming from idiots on the Progressive Left like Al Gore and the like.

    Leave a comment:


  • Nick the Noodle
    replied
    Originally posted by SRV Ron View Post

    Just how many people will willingly give up their lifestyle and freedom for a life of slavery in The Collective just for the sake of stopping Climate Change? True, there are many alternatives. Some are good, such as industry working to operate more efficiently and control pollution. Others worthless such as relying on solar power to charge the batteries of the electric cars when one considers how environmentally damaging it is to manufacture the batteries and solar panels, not to mention turning acres of cropland or meadows into solar farms. But, that's not what the Far Left Environmentalist want. They want drastic changes NOW. No cows, no aircraft, no power generation using coal, oil, gas, hydropower, or nuclear and the retrofitting of all inhabited structures to sustainable use according to Representative Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez, who is running for President. Therefore, according to them, a Scorched Earth or Communism is the only solution for curing Global Warming, Climate Change, whatever it is being called according to if it is getting warmer, or cooler.

    https://www.bloomberg.com/news/artic...green-new-deal
    Worthless at the moment, but the tech on solar energy and batteries will get there. Further, infertile deserts make excellent locations for solar power.

    I am a current fan of nuclear power, and believe we will eventually be able to harness the energy in the radioactive waste, so I am not a leftie Green.

    Communism is a nice idea, but simply doesn't work.

    We do need to do something quickly, but I now feel its probably too late, and our descendants will suffer from our selfish stupidity.

    Leave a comment:


  • SRV Ron
    replied
    Originally posted by Nick the Noodle View Post

    Are you telling me that the only options are Scorched Earth or Communism? A rather blinkered view imho.

    We could adopt a Scandinavian stance as one of many alternatives.
    Just how many people will willingly give up their lifestyle and freedom for a life of slavery in The Collective just for the sake of stopping Climate Change? True, there are many alternatives. Some are good, such as industry working to operate more efficiently and control pollution. Others worthless such as relying on solar power to charge the batteries of the electric cars when one considers how environmentally damaging it is to manufacture the batteries and solar panels, not to mention turning acres of cropland or meadows into solar farms. But, that's not what the Far Left Environmentalist want. They want drastic changes NOW. No cows, no aircraft, no power generation using coal, oil, gas, hydropower, or nuclear and the retrofitting of all inhabited structures to sustainable use according to Representative Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez, who is running for President. Therefore, according to them, a Scorched Earth or Communism is the only solution for curing Global Warming, Climate Change, whatever it is being called according to if it is getting warmer, or cooler.

    https://www.bloomberg.com/news/artic...green-new-deal

    Leave a comment:


  • Nick the Noodle
    replied
    Originally posted by SRV Ron View Post

    So, even though we are not basking in record hot weather in November, that we didn't have a torrid summer of 1988, that we should still panic over the reports of Global Warming by the Fake News Media?

    What do you think the solution is? Submit to the panic and become "Sheep" to be led to the slaughter of population control? Give up out lifestyle, our property, our freedom and be moved into sustainable communes where our worth to the Collective will determine how long we live? Well guess what? That is exactly what people like Al Gore and world leaders at the UN, those that hate what the Unites States stand for, want as a solution to a problem that has been caused by changes in the sun's energy output, decaying plants, termites, volcanic eruptions, and other natural causes in a far greater percentage then modern and ancient society has influence. New technology like 5G will help to speed things along as we become hostage to the powers that control this new emerging, near X-Ray in the electronic spectrum, high speed data collection technology.

    https://massawakening.org/5g-depopulation-agenda/
    It's no secret that the Chinese Communist have developed the technology with a massive surveillance program of it population in order to control them.
    https://www.newyorker.com/news/annal...the-5g-network
    And, the plan to depopulate the world in order to stop Global Warming.
    https://www.disclose.tv/agenda-21-th...by-2030-313560
    Are you telling me that the only options are Scorched Earth or Communism? A rather blinkered view imho.

    We could adopt a Scandinavian stance as one of many alternatives.

    Leave a comment:

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