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  • Originally posted by Gooner View Post
    Duh, yes. Doesn't the EU want a trade deal?
    As long as the integrity of the EU, the four freedoms (single market), and the customs union are respected while avoiding hard border from the island of Ireland.
    No. Any WTO member can object to it, but only on non-spurious grounds.
    If they seem to be sidelined due to the lack of tariffs between the EU and the UK in a case where the future relationship between the EU and the UK is yet to be determined then they would have 'non-spurious grounds' for a complaint. You do understand that the article 24 is for finalizing already pre-existing and almost fully negotiated agreement, not for kicking the can further down the road?
    The WTO likes world trade. They do not like global economic shocks. The WTO would like the the UK and the EU to continue free and as frictionless trade as possible. Their rules permit this.
    Only on certain conditions which you so blithely seem to be repeatedly glossing over. And even then WTO as such doesn't have much say - only the WTO member states really do and they are fair number o them which are very likely to object such an attempt of kicking the can by the UK.
    The EU doesn't want to encourager les autres will therefore ...
    I have no idea what you are referring to here. And i doubt it means what you thought it did either.
    Definition of pour encourager les autres
    : in order to encourage the others —said ironically of an action (such as an execution) carried out as a warning to others
    It is by caffeine alone I set my mind in motion, it is by the beans of Java that thoughts acquire speed. The hands acquire shaking, the shaking becomes a warning. It is by caffeine alone I set my mind in motion

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    • Originally posted by Vaeltaja View Post
      As long as the integrity of the EU, the four freedoms (single market), and the customs union are respected while avoiding hard border from the island of Ireland.


      If they seem to be sidelined due to the lack of tariffs between the EU and the UK in a case where the future relationship between the EU and the UK is yet to be determined then they would have 'non-spurious grounds' for a complaint.
      You haven't got a clue.

      You do understand that the article 24 is for finalizing already pre-existing and almost fully negotiated agreement, not for kicking the can further down the road?
      You don't think the EU and UK have an existing trade agreement?

      Only on certain conditions which you so blithely seem to be repeatedly glossing over. And even then WTO as such doesn't have much say - only the WTO member states really do and they are fair number o them which are very likely to object such an attempt of kicking the can by the UK.
      What 'kicking the can'? The UK wanted to start negotiating on trade as soon as Article 50. Accusations that the UK for some reason want to delay a trade deal are unwarranted.

      I have no idea what you are referring to here. And i doubt it means what you thought it did either.
      Well you've always struck me as a bit of a cupid stunt.

      It is a matter of first principal that the EU doesn't want to make any member state escaping it as easy or attractive.
      After all the EU has most to lose.

      Comment


      • Originally posted by Gooner View Post
        You haven't got a clue.
        Then it appears just about every one apart from the JRM funclub has no clue - https://tradebetablog.wordpress.com/...-grace-period/ && https://www.reuters.com/article/us-b...-idUSKCN1PH24V && https://www.independent.co.uk/news/b...-a8752811.html && https://blogs.lse.ac.uk/brexit/2018/...uk-industries/ and so on. But these are all by experts and you seem to be allergic to such information.
        You don't think the EU and UK have an existing trade agreement?
        For one strictly according to WTO terms, no they do not (not the SM or the CU). Second is that it doesn't really matter what status now is, what matters is what is beyond mutually agreed as the target for the negotiations.
        What 'kicking the can'? The UK wanted to start negotiating on trade as soon as Article 50. Accusations that the UK for some reason want to delay a trade deal are unwarranted.
        Which really can not be determined until the actual future relationship between the EU and the UK has been determined first. There is a reason why the withdrawal agreement was there to be completed first.
        It is a matter of first principal that the EU doesn't want to make any member state escaping it as easy or attractive. After all the EU has most to lose.
        You got that a bit wrong. How attractive it is or is not doesn't really matter. The point is that no leaving country can have better conditions than what a member state has. Which should not be any kind of a surprise to any one. And leaving is easy - all you need to do is use the article 50.
        It is by caffeine alone I set my mind in motion, it is by the beans of Java that thoughts acquire speed. The hands acquire shaking, the shaking becomes a warning. It is by caffeine alone I set my mind in motion

        Comment


        • Originally posted by Vaeltaja View Post
          Then it appears just about every one apart from the JRM funclub has no clue - https://tradebetablog.wordpress.com/...-grace-period/ && https://www.reuters.com/article/us-b...-idUSKCN1PH24V && https://www.independent.co.uk/news/b...-a8752811.html && https://blogs.lse.ac.uk/brexit/2018/...uk-industries/ and so on. But these are all by experts and you seem to be allergic to such information.
          They may have a point. You babbling about vetoes show that you do not.

          For one strictly according to WTO terms, no they do not (not the SM or the CU).
          Uh, could you point us to those terms. Just so we're clear.

          Second is that it doesn't really matter what status now is, what matters is what is beyond mutually agreed as the target for the negotiations.
          From a British POV that could be done on one sheet of paper. The EU is the problem.

          Which really can not be determined until the actual future relationship between the EU and the UK has been determined first. There is a reason why the withdrawal agreement was there to be completed first.
          This is entirely an EU created problem. The UK is used to operating in a decent and honourable role. The EU, meh, not so much.

          You got that a bit wrong. How attractive it is or is not doesn't really matter. The point is that no leaving country can have better conditions than what a member state has. Which should not be any kind of a surprise to any one. And leaving is easy - all you need to do is use the article 50.
          That is hilariously wrong!

          Comment


          • Originally posted by Gooner View Post
            They may have a point. You babbling about vetoes show that you do not.
            They are saying the exact same what i did.
            Uh, could you point us to those terms. Just so we're clear.
            You can find that out yourself quite easily if you just bother to do it. The main underlying reason is that the EU member states are represented in the WTO just by the EU - so the agreements between member states are not WTO agreements in a sense.
            From a British POV that could be done on one sheet of paper. The EU is the problem.
            We are discussing realistic options now, not some fantasies by the UK.
            This is entirely an EU created problem. The UK is used to operating in a decent and honourable role. The EU, meh, not so much.
            No. It is a problem created by Brexit. The future relations have to be agreed first.
            That is hilariously wrong!
            Why don't you prove us how then?
            It is by caffeine alone I set my mind in motion, it is by the beans of Java that thoughts acquire speed. The hands acquire shaking, the shaking becomes a warning. It is by caffeine alone I set my mind in motion

            Comment


            • Originally posted by Gooner View Post

              The appointment of Martin Selmayr as Secretary General?
              I take it you are impressed by the ability of "The Beast of Barleyamont" to manage career-furthering intrigue inside the labyrinth of the administrative apparatus? Well, we can all be.

              But it's still as Vaeltaja already pointed out:
              The Commission play no part in deal other than assisting Barnier. Blonk...
              Effectively you are pathologically focused on the help. But that is part of the UK conspiracy theories about the EU, so...

              Comment


              • The long toll of the brave
                Is not lost in darkness
                Over the fruitful earth
                And athwart the seas
                Hath passed the light of noble deeds
                Unquenchable forever.

                Comment


                • Originally posted by Gooner View Post
                  From a British POV that could be done on one sheet of paper. The EU is the problem. (...…)

                  This is entirely an EU created problem. The UK is used to operating in a decent and honourable role. The EU, meh, not so much.
                  On this side there's no real "problem" - there are established procedures for trade with EU members, or non-EU members, with a deal or no deal.

                  Nothing needs to be made up or invented by March 29, just the suitable option needs to be picked and implemented.

                  It certainly appears the EU is better prepared for Brexit (with or without a deal), than the UK itself, which is strange to say the least.

                  Whether or not this is "honourable" I can't say - but it sure is practical.
                  Last edited by Snowygerry; 01 Mar 19, 05:00.
                  High Admiral Snowy, Commander In Chief of the Naval Forces of The Phoenix Confederation.

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                  • Cromwell? The religious fundamentalist who banned Christmas as a celebration (including singing) and murdered his way around Ireland. That Cromwell?
                    What did Pol Pot have to say about Parliament?
                    "The thing about quotes on the internet is that you cannot confirm their
                    validity." - Abraham Lincoln.
                    "Nothing's going to change while one side it lying about the cause and the other is lying about the solution" - Me

                    Comment


                    • Originally posted by E.D. Morel View Post
                      Cromwell? The religious fundamentalist who banned Christmas as a celebration (including singing) and murdered his way around Ireland. That Cromwell?
                      What did Pol Pot have to say about Parliament?
                      If Pol Pot had been English you just know some people on this forum would be treating him as a national hero for showing those pesky foreigners what for.

                      My personal favourite contribution to this thread is the poster who claimed the EU was trying to 'annexe' Ulster (complete with predictable swallowing of said absurdity by one of our hysterical Americans), and later claimed the EU was the only party insisting on a hard border between the UK and Ireland....which would seem to be pretty much the opposite thing.

                      I am glad that distance affords me the luxury of treating this stuff as a form of comedic performance art. Now I understand why my ancestors spent months at sea in a 30 meter boat packed with 230 people to get as far away from England as they could.
                      Last edited by BF69; 01 Mar 19, 18:08. Reason: typo
                      Human beings are the only creatures on Earth that claim a god and the only living thing that behaves like it hasn't got one - Hunter S. Thompson

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by Snowygerry View Post

                        On this side there's no real "problem" - there are established procedures for trade with EU members, or non-EU members, with a deal or no deal.

                        Nothing needs to be made up or invented by March 29, just the suitable option needs to be picked and implemented.

                        It certainly appears the EU is better prepared for Brexit (with or without a deal), than the UK itself, which is strange to say the least.

                        Whether or not this is "honourable" I can't say - but it sure is practical.
                        5c75715c36000006186b0195.jpg
                        "Ask not what your country can do for you"

                        Left wing, Right Wing same bird that they are killing.

                        you’re entitled to your own opinion but not your own facts.

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                        • Originally posted by Von Richter View Post
                          And then he abolished parliament in a military coup, and ruled himself...

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                          • Originally posted by E.D. Morel View Post
                            Cromwell? The religious fundamentalist who banned Christmas as a celebration (including singing) and murdered his way around Ireland. That Cromwell?
                            What did Pol Pot have to say about Parliament?
                            Although Cromwell was pretty odious it was not him that banned Christmas - the legislation passed through parliament before he became Lord Protector and was initiated by the MPs that he later kicked out. He didn't shed any tears over it it is true.
                            Human history becomes more and more a race between education and catastrophe (H G Wells)
                            Mit der Dummheit kaempfen Goetter selbst vergebens (Friedrich von Schiller)

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                            • Originally posted by Johan Banér View Post
                              And then he abolished parliament in a military coup, and ruled himself...
                              Love the way the only bit that generates comment is Ollie banning Crimbo...
                              I suppose the rest of the codswallop is just accepted as a given!




                              The long toll of the brave
                              Is not lost in darkness
                              Over the fruitful earth
                              And athwart the seas
                              Hath passed the light of noble deeds
                              Unquenchable forever.

                              Comment


                              • In reference to Brexit this ruler is probably more relevant

                                Workshop_of_Hans_Holbein_the_Younger_-_Portrait_of_Henry_VIII_-_Google_Art_Project.jpg

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