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  • Originally posted by walle View Post
    The European Union reminds me of an abusive wife where the husband can't divorce her without first getting emotionally and financially destroyed in the process.
    You're funny.

    Brexit has become a running joke here, when one used to say "I'll be right back honey..." these days they say I'm going "Brexit" which means 6 years later I'll still be just where I'm now,

    but I'll pretend it's all your fault

    As far as I'm concerned the European Union should be consigned to the pages of history, where it belongs.
    The "pages of history" are full off "European Unions" there would be little history without them.

    The UK itself is a European Union.
    High Admiral Snowy, Commander In Chief of the Naval Forces of The Phoenix Confederation.

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    • Originally posted by Gooner View Post
      I don't think Dominic Cummings was a member of the Bullingdon Club though
      That I don't know, but a lot has been made here about his intent to "reboot" the system, anyone know what that means exactly ?

      Also often referred to as the Brexit Rasputin
      High Admiral Snowy, Commander In Chief of the Naval Forces of The Phoenix Confederation.

      Comment


      • Originally posted by Snowygerry View Post
        The "pages of history" are full off "European Unions" there would be little history without them.

        The UK itself is a European Union.
        The pages of history are not full of European Unions at all, since Europe is a continent and not a country. There are however past Unions and alliances between European countries, sure.

        What they all have in common is that they eventually failed because they were forced, and because they didn't have the ethnic and cultural cohesion and homogeneity among the populations within these unions and alliances.

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        • The pages of history are not full of European Unions at all, since Europe is a continent and not a country. There are however past Unions and alliances between European countries, sure.
          And the EU is just the xxth one of those, precisely my point.

          It too will "fall" one day, everything falls - that's the essence of history,

          or gravity

          There were "unions" before there were "countries" btw, nationalism is a rather new kid on the block.
          High Admiral Snowy, Commander In Chief of the Naval Forces of The Phoenix Confederation.

          Comment


          • Originally posted by Snowygerry View Post
            It too will "fall" one day, everything falls - that's the essence of history,
            It sure will, and I rather see it happen sooner than later. It might as well be now, which was my point.

            Originally posted by Snowygerry View Post
            There were "unions" before there were "countries" btw, nationalism is a rather new kid on the block.
            National identity is not particularly new at all, around a 1000 years or so. Before that it was tribal identity, when we lived in smaller groups etc.

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            • Originally posted by walle View Post
              National identity is not particularly new at all, around a 1000 years or so. Before that it was tribal identity, when we lived in smaller groups etc.
              Indeed.

              just recently I was reading a 12th century monk writing about the "fundamental" differences between Germans and Franks, with a Roman pope thrown in for good measure,

              I'll see if I can post it here later …...

              although we risk throwing this thread OT which would be a shame, best to have a seperate discussion in a new one

              Edit,

              Last edited by Snowygerry; 04 Sep 19, 09:01.
              High Admiral Snowy, Commander In Chief of the Naval Forces of The Phoenix Confederation.

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              • Originally posted by walle View Post
                The European Union reminds me of an abusive wife where the husband can't divorce her without first getting emotionally and financially destroyed in the process.

                She wants the house, his money, alimony, his belongings and to amputate his very soul, only when this has been achieved will she be happy enough to let him go.

                As far as I'm concerned the European Union should be consigned to the pages of history, where it belongs.
                If it does I'd say you haven't actually looked into how the EU works.

                If the EU didn't exist we'd invent it. As soon as the current format goes, another will already be in the works.

                Comment


                • Originally posted by Johan Banér View Post
                  If the EU didn't exist we'd invent it. As soon as the current format goes, another will already be in the works.
                  We'd take more care to not "overexpand" it this time around though.

                  The EU formation bumped into the fall of the Soviet Union and it is consequently larger than it was ever intended to be imho.

                  Ironically - it was the Brits and the US that drove the expansion eastward, the first to complain now,

                  well, these things happen.
                  High Admiral Snowy, Commander In Chief of the Naval Forces of The Phoenix Confederation.

                  Comment


                  • Originally posted by walle View Post
                    The European Union reminds me of an abusive wife where the husband can't divorce her without first getting emotionally and financially destroyed in the process.

                    She wants the house, his money, alimony, his belongings and to amputate his very soul, only when this has been achieved will she be happy enough to let him go.
                    You are quite a bit mistaken. The EU has not placed any kind of punitive measures on the UK. What it has stated is that the UK should uphold its financial commitments which lead to the financial settlement. That the UK should decide on the level (see Barnier's stair slide) of future cooperation. And that the UK should figure out a solution to the UK border on the island of Ireland that upholds both the EU single market, the EU customs union, the Good Friday Agreement and the UK sovereignty (just trying underline the problem with the Irish border which is something the UK itself created).

                    So what you were writing is at best rather disingenuous. The fact is that the EU can not and will not stop the UK from leaving - so that part you have gotten totally wrong. What the EU expects is that the UK upholds the commitments the UK has previously made - that should not be too much to ask for.



                    Originally posted by walle View Post
                    What they all have in common is that they eventually failed because they were forced, and because they didn't have the ethnic and cultural cohesion and homogeneity among the populations within these unions and alliances.
                    No one is forcing the UK to stay. In fact the the whole process is a result of the UK wanting to leave. What the UK can not do is to choose to be partially in after leaving which is what some seem to wish. In other words you can not have the perks of the EU membership without being an EU member state or without similar approach which the Norway & Switzerland have (i.e. partial access for a reduced membership fee, but without say). But no one is forcing the UK to stay.



                    Originally posted by walle View Post
                    It sure will, and I rather see it happen sooner than later. It might as well be now, which was my point.
                    If it falls then it falls. But i fail to see relevance since nothing what you have tried to linked to the EU actually relates to the EU. The EU can not hold any member states in it against their own will. The EU can not force countries to join it either. All that has to be out of their own volition. What you can't do however is pick and choose which parts you want and which you don't - it is a package deal.
                    It is by caffeine alone I set my mind in motion, it is by the beans of Java that thoughts acquire speed. The hands acquire shaking, the shaking becomes a warning. It is by caffeine alone I set my mind in motion

                    Comment


                    • Originally posted by walle View Post
                      The European Union reminds me of an abusive wife where the husband can't divorce her without first getting emotionally and financially destroyed in the process.

                      She wants the house, his money, alimony, his belongings and to amputate his very soul, only when this has been achieved will she be happy enough to let him go.
                      More like a spouse who keeps saying their leaving but still wants to eat the food in the fridge, cook their meals, take a dump and watch the TV in the house whenever they want without paying any of the bills.

                      Originally posted by walle View Post
                      As far as I'm concerned the European Union should be consigned to the pages of history, where it belongs.
                      Sure, because all the EU has done is make all it's members richer, freer and more stable while protecting the rights and freedoms of the citizens of the countries within the Union. Who wants that?

                      The reason Brexit won't work is because the Britain that the Brexiteers are harkening back to had an empire and empires are built on conquest, blood, exploitation and suffering. Nothing to be proud of.
                      "The thing about quotes on the internet is that you cannot confirm their
                      validity." - Abraham Lincoln.
                      "Nothing's going to change while one side it lying about the cause and the other is lying about the solution" - Me

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                      • The trout who swims against the current gets the most oxygen..

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                        • BoJo asks the question that matters.
                          "The thing about quotes on the internet is that you cannot confirm their
                          validity." - Abraham Lincoln.
                          "Nothing's going to change while one side it lying about the cause and the other is lying about the solution" - Me

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                          • Originally posted by E.D. Morel View Post
                            Sure, because all the EU has done is make all it's members richer, freer and more stable while protecting the rights and freedoms of the citizens of the countries within the Union. Who wants that?

                            The reason Brexit won't work is because the Britain that the Brexiteers are harkening back to had an empire and empires are built on conquest, blood, exploitation and suffering. Nothing to be proud of.
                            Brilliant. Give the old 'What has Rome ever done for us' schtick then accuse the Leavers of being the ones dreaming of Empire!


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                            • Originally posted by Gooner View Post

                              Brilliant. Give the old 'What has Rome ever done for us' schtick then accuse the Leavers of being the ones dreaming of Empire!

                              What on earth are you talking about?
                              "The thing about quotes on the internet is that you cannot confirm their
                              validity." - Abraham Lincoln.
                              "Nothing's going to change while one side it lying about the cause and the other is lying about the solution" - Me

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by E.D. Morel View Post

                                What on earth are you talking about?
                                Boris has been under the hair drier to long if he figures he can "threaten" the EU into giving him a deal when the Brits have strung out this fiasco for three + years.....The UK is a non player with no power on the world stage but the Britexers cannot get it through their heads their power and empire went belly up many years ago......Boris has been listening to Trump to long and belives a bunch of the BS coming out of the US .........this horse has been beat to long....

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