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Ireland to drop 8th ammendment

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  • #46
    If people who are enthusiastically pro choice would witness a killing of a fetus or child they wouldn't be so enthusiastic anymore the least they would probably want is that it would be more humane in the killing of a fetus or child but since they're so politically motivated on the issue it's not likely to happen.

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    • #47
      Weird thing, those opposed to abortion support the death penalty while those who support abortion oppose the death penalty...

      Just say'n...
      Credo quia absurdum.


      Quantum mechanics describes nature as absurd from the point of view of common sense. And yet it fully agrees with experiment. So I hope you can accept nature as She is - absurd! - Richard Feynman

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      • #48
        Originally posted by Urban hermit View Post

        How can this be if a person who kills a pregnant woman can be charged with murdering two people?
        Only in the US I think, same logic that makes you convict people to 12x life in prison.

        Everything is always "more" and "bigger" over there
        High Admiral Snowy, Commander In Chief of the Naval Forces of The Phoenix Confederation.

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        • #49
          Originally posted by Bwaha View Post
          Weird thing, those opposed to abortion support the death penalty while those who support abortion oppose the death penalty...

          Just say'n...
          You clearly haven't read at least two posters who contradict that, just say'n.

          I really want to make the joke about making abortion retroactive but I won't.

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          • #50
            Originally posted by Urban hermit View Post

            How can this be if a person who kills a pregnant woman can be charged with murdering two people?
            Not here. A unborn child is not a juridical person.
            There are no Nazis in Ukraine. © Idiots

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            • #51
              One question for those who support abortion, and insist that unborn are not humans.
              Is there any case where human life was not the product of conception?
              Dispite our best intentions, the system is dysfunctional that intelligence failure is guaranteed.
              Russ Travers, CIA analyst, 2001

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              • #52
                Nope
                There are no Nazis in Ukraine. © Idiots

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                • #53
                  Originally posted by E.D. Morel View Post
                  . . . . The triumphalist celebrations afterwards were in bad. So much of this became about identity politics rather than abortion that those celebrations were not surprising. Unfortunately many in the liberal establishment don't understand that a cornerstone of being a liberal is free speech and their vociferous silencing of those who hold conservative views is deeply concerning. I say that as a secularist liberal. . . . .

                  The role and rights of the father hadnít even occurred to her. That speaks volumes to me about how tied up this issue is with identity politics (feminism, liberalism, secularism etc.).

                  The thing is that it's too important and emotive an issue to be hijacked like that.
                  This is one of the most thoughtful, and insightful, comments about abortion that I've read, seen, or heard in a very long time. Regardless of one's political persuasion, the decision to terminate a pregnancy is never a small one, and is usually fraught with tremendous quantities of ethical, moral, religious, philosophical, and emotional angst: a point also expressed by Pirateship1982, as well. To be frank, our political cultures -- in the US, the Irish Republic, the UK, probably most of Western Europe -- no longer consider the impact of their rhetoric and policies on the very individuals who will certainly have to bear the burden of those policies, for both good and ill. We're living in an era where politics now trump people. It's like we're living through the Russian Revolution Redux. "The personal life is dead." To be an active and inquisitive citizen who happens to hold certain views is now meaningless: self-identifying with this or that group is what's of paramount importance now. The individual has well and truly lost.

                  But since I'm an old fart who compulsively marches out of step to the chattering masses, I can only say "go f*ck yourself, Carol Hanisch." I'm not ready to be but an anonymous component in a greater aggregate: I'm still an individual, and I intend to remain so.
                  I was married for two ******* years! Hell would be like Club Med! - Sam Kinison

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                  • #54
                    A thread about abortion in Ireland ends up about gun control in America...
                    "The thing about quotes on the internet is that you cannot confirm their
                    validity." - Abraham Lincoln.
                    "Nothing's going to change while one side it lying about the cause and the other is lying about the solution" - Me

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                    • #55
                      Originally posted by Bwaha View Post
                      Weird thing, those opposed to abortion support the death penalty while those who support abortion oppose the death penalty...

                      Just say'n...
                      Any stranger than supporters of abortion who argue the legal status of a fetus, which is that a fetus is not a human.
                      but insists that global warming be supported by scientific fact.
                      heres a scientific fact, without human interference a health fetus is what you were.
                      Strange, if the fetus isnít human why would anyone care if an expectant mother use drugs, smoke, or drink booze?
                      but you do donít you?
                      Dispite our best intentions, the system is dysfunctional that intelligence failure is guaranteed.
                      Russ Travers, CIA analyst, 2001

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                      • #56
                        A foetus is a human in formation. It's not a finished product.
                        There are no Nazis in Ukraine. © Idiots

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                        • #57
                          Originally posted by Emtos View Post
                          A foetus is a human in formation. It's not a finished product.
                          That is where the question of viability comes into the picture. As you and I and everyone reading this are the product of the gestation process and survivors of the journey down the birth canal, should we be the final judge on the matter?
                          This goes back to my points, if the fetus is nothing more than a lump of cells until a doctor touches it, then why should anyone care if the mother uses drugs, alcohol or tobacco?
                          Seems to be a bit of a double standard, first, legally the mother can be charged with endangering her child if she is a drug addict. There are warnings on cigarettes advising pregnant women not to use tobacco, and in many parts of the world there are legal ramifications for endangering a unborn child.
                          but how can that be if it is nothing more than a tumor with a future?
                          Dispite our best intentions, the system is dysfunctional that intelligence failure is guaranteed.
                          Russ Travers, CIA analyst, 2001

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                          • #58
                            Originally posted by Urban hermit View Post

                            That is where the question of viability comes into the picture. As you and I and everyone reading this are the product of the gestation process and survivors of the journey down the birth canal, should we be the final judge on the matter?
                            We not. Parents yes.

                            Originally posted by Urban hermit View Post
                            This goes back to my points, if the fetus is nothing more than a lump of cells until a doctor touches it, then why should anyone care if the mother uses drugs, alcohol or tobacco?
                            Seems to be a bit of a double standard, first, legally the mother can be charged with endangering her child if she is a drug addict. There are warnings on cigarettes advising pregnant women not to use tobacco, and in many parts of the world there are legal ramifications for endangering a unborn child.
                            but how can that be if it is nothing more than a tumor with a future?
                            If the cells are damaged in the beginning, there are big chances that the child will have health issues or die. But it doesn't mean that the cells can be called a human from the very start.
                            There are no Nazis in Ukraine. © Idiots

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                            • #59
                              Originally posted by Emtos View Post

                              We not. Parents yes.



                              If the cells are damaged in the beginning, there are big chances that the child will have health issues or die. But it doesn't mean that the cells can be called a human from the very start.
                              If it isnít human why do surgeons preform prenatal heart surgery on them?
                              Dispite our best intentions, the system is dysfunctional that intelligence failure is guaranteed.
                              Russ Travers, CIA analyst, 2001

                              Comment


                              • #60
                                Originally posted by Urban hermit View Post

                                If it isnít human why do surgeons preform prenatal heart surgery on them?
                                What is the problem with that ? You can do this on other mammals if you want so.
                                There are no Nazis in Ukraine. © Idiots

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