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  • China expected to layoff 1.8 million+

    I'm not sure if this was ever surpassed.

    http://www.bloomberg.com/news/articl...-capacity-cuts

    Imagine if all those people decide to do something organized to protest this like people do in other countries.

    I don't know, maybe they'll just...

    Disappear.

  • #2
    Interesting times. First the stock market crisis, now this. China is having some serious issues.
    Any man can hold his place when the bands play and women throw flowers; it is when the enemy presses close and metal shears through the ranks that one can acertain which are soldiers, and which are not.

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    • #3
      Nothing will happen. Just nothing.
      There are no Nazis in Ukraine. Idiots

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      • #4
        Originally posted by Arnold J Rimmer View Post
        Interesting times. First the stock market crisis, now this. China is having some serious issues.
        China's economic problems worry me more than anything happening in Europe.

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        • #5
          Originally posted by Emtos View Post
          Nothing will happen. Just nothing.
          Funny, that's the only thing that I know won't happen. I don't know what'll happen but something definitely will.
          "Artillery lends dignity to what might otherwise be a vulgar brawl." - Frederick the Great

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          • #6
            The problem is that in a command economy the State can divert those workers to something else - back in Peter the Great's time in Russia it would have meant an invasion of somewhere, probably the Ottoman Empire.
            Human history becomes more and more a race between education and catastrophe (H G Wells)
            Mit der Dummheit kaempfen Goetter selbst vergebens (Friedrich von Schiller)

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            • #7
              Originally posted by Emtos View Post
              Nothing will happen. Just nothing.
              Well now the number of projected layoffs has increased to possibly 6 million+.

              http://www.reuters.com/article/us-ch...-idUSKCN0W33DS

              So nothing x3.

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              • #8
                Any idea what percentage that 6M (or 1.8M) is in the industry? Or how significantly it will add to the unemployment rate?
                "We have no white flag."

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                • #9
                  China has what used to be called concealed unemployment which basically means workers who whilst they may work very hard add either nothing or even worse less than nothing to the net output of the economic unit in which they work (they have zero or negative productivity). 50 odd years ago this was seen as particularly a problem of very poor peasant style agricultural economies such as found in parts of India, S E Asia and the most backward parts of the US deep south usually where people were employed on family farms which would have produced at least as much if they had spent all day in bed instead of toiling in the fields. It was regarded as a diminishing problem as as industrialisation progressed these people would be attracted off the farms into cities and employed in factories. However it is possible where there is a command economy or one where jobs are protected by state aid to create industrial units that are but larger versions of those family farms and have some workers with zero or negative productivity. Today these are sometimes referred to as zombie units. In a rapidly growing economy these can be combed out as the demand for labour in the efficient sectors keeps increasing. If there is already too much capacity in these sectors then there is a "time bomb" of concealed unemployment that will become all too visible as it becomes impossible to continue to support the zombie companies. This appears to be at the heart of China's problems.
                  Human history becomes more and more a race between education and catastrophe (H G Wells)
                  Mit der Dummheit kaempfen Goetter selbst vergebens (Friedrich von Schiller)

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                  • #10
                    Originally posted by Daemon of Decay View Post
                    China's economic problems worry me more than anything happening in Europe.
                    It's a problem that will probably reverberate worldwide. We can take a detached "that's their problem" stance - but I doubt it will remain that way.
                    Michele

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                    • #11
                      Originally posted by MarkV View Post
                      The problem is that in a command economy the State can divert those workers to something else - back in Peter the Great's time in Russia it would have meant an invasion of somewhere, probably the Ottoman Empire.
                      Perhaps the US and Europe/EU can employ them building some walls to thwart unwanted migrations? They built quite an impressive one some time back. Here in the UK we can build our own, if I recall it was the Romans that got the locals to knock up a couple of them to keep out the northern tribes and control trade.

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                      • #12
                        Originally posted by Wooden Wonder View Post
                        Perhaps the US and Europe/EU can employ them building some walls to thwart unwanted migrations? They built quite an impressive one some time back.
                        But how do they get the Mexican government to pay for it?
                        Human history becomes more and more a race between education and catastrophe (H G Wells)
                        Mit der Dummheit kaempfen Goetter selbst vergebens (Friedrich von Schiller)

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                        • #13
                          Seeing as its such a small percentage of its population I don't see its of much effect.

                          .0013 to be specific.
                          Credo quia absurdum.


                          Quantum mechanics describes nature as absurd from the point of view of common sense. And yet it fully agrees with experiment. So I hope you can accept nature as She is - absurd! - Richard Feynman

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                          • #14
                            Originally posted by MarkV View Post
                            China has what used to be called concealed unemployment which basically means workers who whilst they may work very hard add either nothing or even worse less than nothing to the net output of the economic unit in which they work (they have zero or negative productivity). 50 odd years ago this was seen as particularly a problem of very poor peasant style agricultural economies such as found in parts of India, S E Asia and the most backward parts of the US deep south usually where people were employed on family farms which would have produced at least as much if they had spent all day in bed instead of toiling in the fields. It was regarded as a diminishing problem as as industrialisation progressed these people would be attracted off the farms into cities and employed in factories. However it is possible where there is a command economy or one where jobs are protected by state aid to create industrial units that are but larger versions of those family farms and have some workers with zero or negative productivity. Today these are sometimes referred to as zombie units. In a rapidly growing economy these can be combed out as the demand for labour in the efficient sectors keeps increasing. If there is already too much capacity in these sectors then there is a "time bomb" of concealed unemployment that will become all too visible as it becomes impossible to continue to support the zombie companies. This appears to be at the heart of China's problems.
                            Good point! There have been many dead weight that the state have been supporting, which the state have been trying to remove for some time now. With a slowing economy, where will these people go? Tick tock...
                            "We have no white flag."

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                            • #15
                              Originally posted by MarkV View Post
                              China has what used to be called concealed unemployment which basically means workers who whilst they may work very hard add either nothing or even worse less than nothing to the net output of the economic unit in which they work (they have zero or negative productivity). 50 odd years ago this was seen as particularly a problem of very poor peasant style agricultural economies such as found in parts of India, S E Asia and the most backward parts of the US deep south usually where people were employed on family farms which would have produced at least as much if they had spent all day in bed instead of toiling in the fields. It was regarded as a diminishing problem as as industrialisation progressed these people would be attracted off the farms into cities and employed in factories. However it is possible where there is a command economy or one where jobs are protected by state aid to create industrial units that are but larger versions of those family farms and have some workers with zero or negative productivity. Today these are sometimes referred to as zombie units. In a rapidly growing economy these can be combed out as the demand for labour in the efficient sectors keeps increasing. If there is already too much capacity in these sectors then there is a "time bomb" of concealed unemployment that will become all too visible as it becomes impossible to continue to support the zombie companies. This appears to be at the heart of China's problems.


                              To be fair, historically poor Chinese peasants have done quite well when given the freedom to prosper.

                              When the British annexed Hong Kong in 1842, they gave the poor illiterate fishing villages the opportunity to prosper. Even today, taxes in Hong Kong are still among the lowest in the world. As a free port, Hong Kong immediately attracted entrepreneurs and speculators from all over the world to set up their operations. People were attracted to the low tax environment, and the fact that the imperial government bureaucrats were over 5,000 miles away. Trade quickly flourished. And as commercial activity grew, the island prospered and rapidly became more developed. Peasants from the mainland migrated to Hong Kong based on the premise that, just like in America, they could work hard and make a life for themselves. Within 20 years the population had increased over ten-fold, and it just continues to grow.

                              Hong Kong earned a reputation for risk-takers. Today, Hong Kong is one of the wealthiest places in the world, with a GDP per capita and standard of living that outpaces most of the West. There are 50% more skyscrapers in Hong Kong than there are in New York City.
                              "Stand for the flag ~ Kneel for the fallen"

                              "A wise man can learn more from a foolish question than a fool can learn from a wise answer." ~ Bruce Lee

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