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  • Chukka
    replied
    Originally posted by Capt AFB View Post
    There are a number of books written about the SAS involvement in Gulf War I, and, at least,three books about Bravo Two Zero. (IIRC, the books are: Bravo Two Zero, The One That Got Away, The Real Story Behind Bravo Two Zero.)

    SAS patrols pretty much plan for their own mission, including how they want to be inserted (depending on available assets) and travel method once on the ground.

    The decision to walk to their target area was the patrol's decision, unlike other patrols, which decided to use Pink Panther jeeps or other vehicle to move around once on the ground...I recall the SAS leadership questionning the patrol about not using a vehicle (they were available) but McNab and his patrol made a case for not needing one...So blaming the brass for bad planning here does not stand.

    As for warmer clothing, again, its a decision by the patrol members what to carry...It is not like SAS members are raw recruits going on their first patrol...And if I recall correctly, they lost their Bergen bags after dropping them during a heavy contact with the Iraqi Army, which may explain why nobody had a extra layer of clothes or sleeping bag when they were escaping Westward towards Syria.
    Close Quarter Battle by Mike Curtis is an interesting read, Curtis was a coal miner who joined the Paras just in time for the Falklands and went through Goose Green. He joined the SAS afterwards and had a pretty successful time in Iraq. Everything was planned out and flexible, especially in terms of clothing and how they used their vehicles. They had dramas with driving at first few nights, so they decided to drive by day. Everyone had their say, with the officer having final veto. Also, with everyone being caught out with poor clothing, one of the QM's bought a few dozen overcoats from a Saudi market, and they were in the field within days.

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  • jeffdoorgunnr
    replied
    reading "Truman"............last of the honest presidents..............

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  • Poor Old Spike
    replied
    Originally posted by Capt AFB View Post
    ..SAS patrols pretty much plan for their own mission..So blaming the brass for bad planning here does not stand..
    Yes, the patrol members have to share most of the blame, personally I'd have refused pointblank to go.
    In fact I read somewhere that one SAS lieutenant(?) did just that, refusing to go on a mission that he didn't agree with, I can't remember if it was the Bravo Two Zero job or another one.
    The writer said something like- "As we embarked without him, we saw him sitting in the HQ office sipping tea".
    Full credit to him..

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  • Capt AFB
    replied
    Originally posted by Poor Old Spike View Post
    I'm reading it again and every time I read it I sit open-mouthed at the sheer bad planning by the brass, as inserting an 8-man SAS patrol by Chinook into the middle of Iraq on foot was never going to work.
    1 escaped, 4 were captured and 1 was killed
    2 others died of hypothermia because nobody thought to issue the squad with sleeping bags or even survival blankets..duh..
    There are a number of books written about the SAS involvement in Gulf War I, and, at least,three books about Bravo Two Zero. (IIRC, the books are: Bravo Two Zero, The One That Got Away, The Real Story Behind Bravo Two Zero.)

    SAS patrols pretty much plan for their own mission, including how they want to be inserted (depending on available assets) and travel method once on the ground.

    The decision to walk to their target area was the patrol's decision, unlike other patrols, which decided to use Pink Panther jeeps or other vehicle to move around once on the ground...I recall the SAS leadership questionning the patrol about not using a vehicle (they were available) but McNab and his patrol made a case for not needing one...So blaming the brass for bad planning here does not stand.

    As for warmer clothing, again, its a decision by the patrol members what to carry...It is not like SAS members are raw recruits going on their first patrol...And if I recall correctly, they lost their Bergen bags after dropping them during a heavy contact with the Iraqi Army, which may explain why nobody had a extra layer of clothes or sleeping bag when they were escaping Westward towards Syria.
    Last edited by Capt AFB; 02 Apr 18, 08:10.

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  • Poor Old Spike
    replied
    Bravo Two Zero by Andy McNab

    I'm reading it again and every time I read it I sit open-mouthed at the sheer bad planning by the brass, as inserting an 8-man SAS patrol by Chinook into the middle of Iraq on foot was never going to work.
    1 escaped, 4 were captured and 1 was killed
    2 others died of hypothermia because nobody thought to issue the squad with sleeping bags or even survival blankets..duh..

    Leave a comment:


  • MarkV
    replied
    Originally posted by Legate View Post
    Sherman had a different view of glory

    Its glory is all moonshine. Even success, the most brilliant is over dead and mangled bodies [] It is only those who have not heard a shot, nor heard the shrills & groans of the wounded & lacerated (friend or foe) that cry aloud for more blood & more vengeance, more desolation

    Letter to James E. Yeatman (May 1865)

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  • Legate
    replied

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  • SmackUm
    replied
    Masters of Empire

    Masters of Empire (Great Lakes Indians & the Making of America) by Michael McDonnell. https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/...ters-of-empire
    A history of Fort Michilimackinac and the relationship of the Anishinnabeg with European trading nations in the Great Lakes Region.

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  • Martok
    replied
    Also reading this, which is quite a good book, actually:

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  • Martok
    replied
    I have been reading this series of books, of which there are currently about twelve each dedicated to a different genre:

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  • Capt AFB
    replied
    Finish reading "Corps Commanders"



    Three Canadians and two British Corps Commanders in WW2.

    The three Canadians are Burns, Simons and Foulkes. The British were Horrock and Crocker. Horrock and Crocker were chosen because they both had one time or another been under Canadian Command or had Canadian divisions under their command.

    The 300-page book certainly not a detailed bio of each individuals, but a good review of each commander and his style of command. It is well researched. The author, Dr Doug Delaney having already wrote a bio on MGen Bert Hoffmeister, who was Canada's best general in WW2.

    I have never heard of Crocker, so that part was quite an interesting read for me.

    The book confirmed to me that Canada did not have any great Generals during WW2 (except for Hoffmeister and possibly Foster.) Burns, Simons and Foulke were the product of a pre-WW2 Permanent Force, which main job was to train reservists and where technical skills were favored over leadership skills. Burns was fired after commanding 1 Canadian Corps in Italy. Simons was ok, if a micromanager. Foulke is an enigma on how could someone raise through the officer ranks with such low level of competence - Delaney explains Foulke's promotions by simply being at the right place at the right time!



    A good read for anyone interested in Canada's contribution in Europe during WW2.
    Last edited by Capt AFB; 02 Mar 18, 13:43.

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  • Capt AFB
    replied
    Originally posted by R.N. Armstrong View Post
    After Jeroen's introduction of Robert Harris and reading "The Officer and A Spy" and "Conclave", I am off and running with "Pompeii" and "Enigma" in the ready rack with "Imperium" on order. I like the author's depth of research, character development, storytelling, and command of the language. For these reasons, I will read Munich despite a disappointed ending for Jeroen.
    Well, I finished listening to "Munich" as an audiobook. Great story. Very well researched. I much enjoyed it, even if the very ending is a bit disappointing, and reads like the author does not know how to stop the story- Although it does not detract from the story. (Feels like Harris woke up one morning, walk to his keyboard before having coffee, and said to himself "Oh, well! Let me type something up that is somewhat coherent to end this tale and send the manuscript to the editor!")

    It gave me a much better appreciation of Chamberlain as British PM dealing with Hitler and the mood of the time.

    I wish I listened to the audio book (or read the book) before seeing the movie Darkest Hour, as it would have provided me even better context.

    I may have become a Robert Harris fan.
    Last edited by Capt AFB; 22 Feb 18, 16:06.

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  • Canuckster
    replied
    Originally posted by Poor Old Spike View Post
    PS- as a matter of interest, below are shots of my current book collection, they're all factual, I never buy fiction.
    hmmmm I noticed the pile contains 'The Martian', 'Arrival' and 'Gravity'.

    Not that there is anything wrong with SciFi (I just wanted to be a smartass).

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  • Tuebor
    replied
    Rereading Robert Asprey's At Belleau Wood

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  • McMax
    replied
    Command Missions - A Personal Story By Lucian Truscott.

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