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  • Berlin is Russian

    Ran the battle twice and the result was the same. Berlin falls to the Red Army thanks to a parachute division forcing the remnants of the garrison to withdraw. And while number of weak German units near the city were simply over run by heavy Red Army tank forces it was all down to getting at least a BR (Both Retreat) and that para unit. Another Red Army para division liberated Copenhagen but it was not enough to tip the point balance away from a Western Allied Victory.

    <<Berlin falls>>



    Western Allied VPs -

    Paris - 5
    Rome - 5
    Ploesti - 5
    Bucherest - 1
    Sofia - 1
    Brussels - 1
    The Hague - 1
    Luxembourg - 1
    Belgrade - 1
    Athens - 1
    Ankara - 1
    German Manufacturing Centres - 14

    Total Allied VP - 37

    Soviet VPs

    Berlin - 20
    Warsaw - 5
    Budapest - 1
    Prague - 1
    Copenhagen - 1
    Kovno - 1
    Riga - 1
    Talinin - 1
    German Manufacturing Centres - 4

    Total Soviet VPs - 35

    Western Allied Victory.

    T'was a long haul gents. Well done.
    Attached Files
    Last edited by The Purist; 08 Apr 11, 09:57.
    The Purist

    Words ought to be a little wild, for they are the assault of thoughts on the unthinking - John Maynard Keynes.

    Comment


    • Will you be opening the social groups up to everyone? I would like to see what my opponents had to say during the game and I wouldn’t mind them knowing what we discussed.

      Very good job to everyone.

      Especially to the Purist for putting up with what had to be a large amount of whining during this game.
      Politics is the art of looking for trouble, finding it whether it exists or not, diagnosing it incorrectly and applying the wrong remedy. -- Ernest Benn

      Comment


      • Highly enjoyable game. I'm going to scan through the other threads to see what the others were up to.
        How to Talk to a Climate Skeptic: http://grist.org/series/skeptics/
        Global Warming & Climate Change Myths: https://www.skepticalscience.com/argument.php

        Comment


        • Originally posted by Tsar View Post
          Will you be opening the social groups up to everyone? I would like to see what my opponents had to say during the game and I wouldn’t mind them knowing what we discussed.

          Very good job to everyone.

          Especially to the Purist for putting up with what had to be a large amount of whining during this game.
          Likewise on all counts.
          "Why is the Rum gone?"

          -Captain Jack

          Comment


          • Obviously the biggest mistake that Germany made was our invasion of Turkey. This was always a gamble. In fact I first labeled it the Balkan Foley when I proposed it. The hope was that we would be able to get through Turkey quickly enough to attack the 8th army from the rear. Lacking that I had hoped to tie down enough of it to allow the Africa corps to win in Libya. Instead we ended up with 2 new enemies and another front to defend. I have to admit I’m shocked at how quickly our position in North Africa fell apart.

            Another possible mistake we may have made was not advancing further into Russia when we could. I argued forcefully to not take enough personnel centers to let Russia go to total war status. I figured that if they were willing to give us a chance to fight them with them tied to limited war I would keep them that way. Judging from the screaming that came about because of it I would say that on one level it worked well. On the other hand if we had pushed harder they would have been back much further when they got their legs back under them and started to advance.
            Politics is the art of looking for trouble, finding it whether it exists or not, diagnosing it incorrectly and applying the wrong remedy. -- Ernest Benn

            Comment


            • Well done and thanks for the game The Purist I am glad it was seen through to the end.

              And heres to my comrades who help drive our Red Army to Berlin

              Thanks for looking!!

              Comment


              • Awesome Gerry, Thanks for running this for us. In some ways I can't believe it's over (there's still so much for Russia to do!)

                A hearty congratulations to our opponents and allies both on a well played and enjoyable campaign.
                BoRG
                "... and that was the last time they called me Freakboy Moses"

                Comment


                • A very special thank you to The Purist for being a most flexible and patient host! I am VERY happy to have been a part of this game AND equally happy to have seen it completed.

                  Nice job to both the Germans and the Soviets for the whole game. I can tell you that there were some times that we were hanging on my a thin thread. If you have any questions about why we did this or that or what we were thinking let me know.

                  Now, what's the next game?
                  "War is sorrowful, but there is one thing infinitely more horrible than the worst horrors of war, and that is the feeling that nothing is worth fighting for..."
                  -- Harper's Weekly, December 31, 1864

                  Comment


                  • Cheers everyone. I've asked the management about a ribbon and was thinking something along the lines of the various WWII ribbons but one that mixes the nationalities. Maybe a Red (Russia), Blue/White (Allied), Black/Gold (Axis) -

                    Red for the Soviets, of course
                    Blue/White for the colours of the flags of France, Britain and the USA
                    Black/Gold for the axis - from darkness into light.

                    Getting the mix right is the challenge.

                    The threads are open, of course, but do remember that lots of the comms were handled by PM so following the flow might not be easy.

                    The folks who set up the Social Groups will have to change them to public views,... I'm not sure how.

                    I'll do a review (long and boring, I'm sure). While each team had their view it was clouded by the fog of war. There were many a moment where I, omnipotent in my view, gave a few gasps of shock and chuckles over lost opportunities and simply sheer good luck.

                    I'l try to have that up this weekend.


                    Next game? That would be the Barbarossa sim about to begin. Less a team game than an attempt to see what can be done in the game framework with a different focus. It is aimed more at the German plans with the Red Arm being handled automatically (by the GM,... ummm, me )
                    Last edited by The Purist; 08 Apr 11, 10:00.
                    The Purist

                    Words ought to be a little wild, for they are the assault of thoughts on the unthinking - John Maynard Keynes.

                    Comment


                    • Allied discussion group is now public:
                      http://www.armchairgeneral.com/forum...php?groupid=53


                      Thanks to everyone for playing, and huge thanks to Purist for running the game!
                      Wisdom is personal

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by Tsar View Post
                        Obviously the biggest mistake that Germany made was our invasion of Turkey. This was always a gamble. In fact I first labeled it the Balkan Foley when I proposed it. The hope was that we would be able to get through Turkey quickly enough to attack the 8th army from the rear. Lacking that I had hoped to tie down enough of it to allow the Africa corps to win in Libya. Instead we ended up with 2 new enemies and another front to defend. I have to admit I’m shocked at how quickly our position in North Africa fell apart.

                        Another possible mistake we may have made was not advancing further into Russia when we could. I argued forcefully to not take enough personnel centers to let Russia go to total war status. I figured that if they were willing to give us a chance to fight them with them tied to limited war I would keep them that way. Judging from the screaming that came about because of it I would say that on one level it worked well. On the other hand if we had pushed harder they would have been back much further when they got their legs back under them and started to advance.
                        One of the best parts of your cunning plan was not to strike deep into the USSR. That way we could continue to mount agressive operations, and yet have the full knowledge that if a disaster happened we would then be no worse off than historically, ie by being able to go into Total War status .

                        As for Turkey, did you consider the terrain ?

                        The war over by mid 44, that must have been very depressing for you .

                        Congratulations to the W Allies .
                        How to Talk to a Climate Skeptic: http://grist.org/series/skeptics/
                        Global Warming & Climate Change Myths: https://www.skepticalscience.com/argument.php

                        Comment


                        • Originally posted by Nick the Noodle View Post
                          As for Turkey, did you consider the terrain ?
                          Yes, I can get away with it about half the time. A lot depends on the die rolls. If we take Greece and Create than we can use Para’s to grab a major port and resupply and repair the rail lines from more than one direction. If the UK and Turkey had to face a double front they would have lost, or at least stopped attacking in North Africa. After North Africa fell there was no reason to stay in Turkey.

                          Originally posted by Nick the Noodle View Post
                          The war over by mid 44, that must have been very depressing for you .
                          Not really I was ready to write it off in ’43. It was obvious at that point that we were not going to win and I saw no reason to prolong the inevitable. Gerry said that you guys should have your chance to kick our butts since we had been doing it to you for 3 ˝ years (but obviously not well enogh).
                          Politics is the art of looking for trouble, finding it whether it exists or not, diagnosing it incorrectly and applying the wrong remedy. -- Ernest Benn

                          Comment


                          • The game is set up to run the historical course, and France went on for 6 months instead of 6 weeks because the Allies were better than their historical counterparts, and because hindsight helps the allies more than the axis.

                            Turkey made sense because that would have broken the historical chain of events, as I have said. When we withdrew, Gigantic Allied forces had already pushed us out of Africa, Sardinia, Corsica and France were being landed on and Italy suddenly surrendered before Sicily had even fallen.
                            Pushing farther in Italy would only have made sense if we could have move our capitol to Ankara.

                            So long Gents, and better luck next time, Twitter
                            "Why is the Rum gone?"

                            -Captain Jack

                            Comment


                            • Originally posted by Exorcist View Post
                              The game is set up to run the historical course, and France went on for 6 months instead of 6 weeks because the Allies were better than their historical counterparts, and because hindsight helps the allies more than the axis.

                              Turkey made sense because that would have broken the historical chain of events, as I have said. When we withdrew, Gigantic Allied forces had already pushed us out of Africa, Sardinia, Corsica and France were being landed on and Italy suddenly surrendered before Sicily had even fallen.
                              Pushing farther in Italy would only have made sense if we could have move our capitol to Ankara.

                              So long Gents, and better luck next time, Twitter
                              Yes, if only we saved a few more para units for the last push we might have made Berlin.
                              "War is sorrowful, but there is one thing infinitely more horrible than the worst horrors of war, and that is the feeling that nothing is worth fighting for..."
                              -- Harper's Weekly, December 31, 1864

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by Tsar View Post
                                Not really I was ready to write it off in ’43. It was obvious at that point that we were not going to win and I saw no reason to prolong the inevitable. Gerry said that you guys should have your chance to kick our butts since we had been doing it to you for 3 ˝ years (but obviously not well enogh).


                                I hope you have apologised to your team mates for your unusual opinions and subsequent outcome . Aside from attacking Turkey, a limited attack against the USSR so as to not invoke total war seems a bit silly? When you win we get stronger. Not a good choice. You need to take out the USSR straight away. You did not and lost.

                                However, hats off to the W.Allies . I admit to being stunned to all their successful invasions so early on. Plus all their aircraft. Either someone knows the game, or we have a budding Scipio/Alexander/Julius Caesar in our midst .
                                How to Talk to a Climate Skeptic: http://grist.org/series/skeptics/
                                Global Warming & Climate Change Myths: https://www.skepticalscience.com/argument.php

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